Pony bottle/reg recommendations

[AbyssalPlains]

Hi all,

I am going to take a solo diver class soon, the main reason being that I do a lot of photography underwater. I am curious as to what those already diving solo recommend in terms of redundant air supply. I don't want to go doubles because I live in a land-locked area and pretty much fly to most of the destinations I dive at. Certain set-ups such as a pony slung to my chest are out of the question in my case because of the camera rig I am hauling around. I am still in the research stage of things and haven't tried anything myself but it appears that in my case I should look at a pony setup strapped to the main tank so it's out of the way. In terms of gear, the Zeagle Razor looks intriguing, based on its compactness, but I currently have the opportunity to obtain Scubapro gear at a very discounted rate and was wondering whether that might be a better investment. I don't know what the reputation and reliability of the Zeagle set-up is and whether people think it is practical. Is the combined valve/first stage in one piece a good thing to have or should I rather go with a standard tank valve (DIN maybe?), a standard first stage (diaphragm?) and an SPG on a hose instead of one directly attached to the valve as would be the case in the Zeagle Razor setup. Also, I hear very different things as to whether a 19 cu-ft Pony bottle is sufficient or not, but I really would try to not go up in size unless there is a vital reason. Any experiences will be greatly appreciated.

 

[tedwhiteva]

The size of the tank really depends on how deep you are going to be and how long you'll be here. Coming from 110 feet with a deep stop and three minute safety stop on a 19 cu ft tank is OK (but just) so long as you're not delayed - like having to recollect all your photo gear after droppng it while you handled the emergency that made you go on to you alternate air source. And your air consumption rate is going to be elevated by the same.
Suggest also that you don't blow off using the slung pony rig without trying it - its not that bad once you're in the water.

 

[The Chad]

Don't know what you have for a bcd right now....but I would get used to diving dbls. You are planning on doing alot of traveling so I would just stick with a BP/W, buy another reg (if you get DIN you can always bring along yoke adps) and invest in a pair of tank bands, since you'll just be rigging up to single 80's on vacation. Down side to this is you're diving independant 80's but if your solo who cares anyways. If you are with some else though both of you better know the set-up and how to share a reg

 

[ClayJar]

With the pony behind you, are you going to mount it upright or inverted. If you mount it inverted, you can reach the valve, should you want to dive with the regulator pressurized and the valve closed (to preclude an undetected slow leak losing all your redundant air). If you choose to have it behind you and inverted for that reason, you'll want a "real" valve with a nice handle instead of the Razor. If you mount it upright and behind you, you're not likely to be able to reach the valve, so it doesn't really matter.

A Razor is nice and integrated, but it's integrated, so you'll only be able to use it on one tank. I like to have the ability to move my pony reg to another cylinder should the need arise, but that may never come up to you.

I'd definitely go with an SPG I can see during the dive, as I don't personally care for trusting my equipment too much. With an SPG, I can verify that I don't appear to be losing any gas. (If you routinely "zone in" when shooting, it's comforting to be able to check that you haven't missed anything.) Slinging would allow you to use a smaller SPG setup, but if slinging gets in the way of the photography, you do what you must. (Please don't sling because people tell you to and then end up bashing coral with the pony while you try to get a shot of a cleaner shrimp. )

An AL19 seems to be the sweet spot for travel. Larger becomes unwieldy, and smaller is often considered insufficient. Truth be told, there *could* be a case where an AL19 ends up being not enough to get to the surface, but "1/4 an AL80" is a considerable amount of reserve. If you run out, you CESA to the surface and maybe take a DCS hit and a chamber ride. If you're in such a poor state that an AL19 isn't enough to get you to the surface alive (although not necessarily unharmed) on an open-water dive, something *very* bad occurred (and would even 30 or 40 cubic feet have been enough?). On the other hand, if you routinely make NDL-pushing dives past 100 feet, an additional 10 or 20 cubic feet comes highly recommended by me.

(My personal figures show that *I* should easily make my normal ascent with stops and make the surface from 115 feet given an AL19, even with a *highly* stressed consumption rate, but those are my rates. Also, since I have an SPG on the pony reg, if I'm starting my ascent and it doesn't look like I have enough gas remaining, I can adjust the stops so that I'll make it to the 15 foot stop. I can then hang there until I'm clear or until the pony bottoms out, at which point I can make the final ascent. I don't mind ending a dive by running out of air at 15 feet if it was while doing extra hang time after dealing with a significant incident.)

 

[spectrum]

As for sizing there can be comfort in knowing what a given cylinder size is capable of. Here is a link to an old post where I broke down a scenario.

Pete

 

[solensdotter]

Hope that this is not considered a hijack (mod, please move this somewhere more "appropriate")!
I did try a search, but didn't find a complete answer, and this thread kept popping up, and my question is at least somehwat similar...

I recently picked up a 40cft tank which I intend to use as a pony/bailout bottle, which I will sling on solo dives and on deeper dives even with buddies. As I am hoping to start tech training within the year, I figure that I can later use this as a deco bottle.

On to the actual question: what regulator set-up do you recommend? I assume that I don't necessarily need to go for a high-level reg, since breathing properties are not as much of an issue for a pony (if it's gotten to the point that I need to use the bottle, I'll be happy to have air and not real concerned whether or not it's an "easy" breather), and as a deco bottle, I would assume that it would be used at shallower depths, since I would likely have an 80cft as a stage or for "lighter" mixes (please correct me if these assumptions are wrong).

Appreciate your input!

 

[The Chad]

Hope that this is not considered a hijack (mod, please move this somewhere more "appropriate")!
I did try a search, but didn't find a complete answer, and this thread kept popping up, and my question is at least somehwat similar...

I recently picked up a 40cft tank which I intend to use as a pony/bailout bottle, which I will sling on solo dives and on deeper dives even with buddies. As I am hoping to start tech training within the year, I figure that I can later use this as a deco bottle.

On to the actual question: what regulator set-up do you recommend? I assume that I don't necessarily need to go for a high-level reg, since breathing properties are not as much of an issue for a pony (if it's gotten to the point that I need to use the bottle, I'll be happy to have air and not real concerned whether or not it's an "easy" breather), and as a deco bottle, I would assume that it would be used at shallower depths, since I would likely have an 80cft as a stage or for "lighter" mixes (please correct me if these assumptions are wrong).

Appreciate your input!

All that you need is a 1st and 2nd stage and a button guage (which some consider optional) The reg needs to be O2 or O4 clean depending on what gas your breathing. Most deco regs are high quaility and even though you are shallow doing bigger deco stops you still want it to breathe easy as you are off gasing. Some guys look at the interchagability too and have 5 regs that are mostly the same. In other words don't take an octo, hook it to a first stage and think you have a deco reg set-up

 

[Doc Intrepid]

I am going to take a solo diver class soon, the main reason being that I do a lot of photography underwater. I am curious as to what those already diving solo recommend in terms of redundant air supply. I don't want to go doubles because I live in a land-locked area and pretty much fly to most of the destinations I dive at. Certain set-ups such as a pony slung to my chest are out of the question in my case because of the camera rig I am hauling around. I am still in the research stage of things and haven't tried anything myself but it appears that in my case I should look at a pony setup strapped to the main tank so it's out of the way. In terms of gear, the Zeagle Razor looks intriguing, based on its compactness, but I currently have the opportunity to obtain Scubapro gear at a very discounted rate and was wondering whether that might be a better investment. I don't know what the reputation and reliability of the Zeagle set-up is and whether people think it is practical. Is the combined valve/first stage in one piece a good thing to have or should I rather go with a standard tank valve (DIN maybe?), a standard first stage (diaphragm?) and an SPG on a hose instead of one directly attached to the valve as would be the case in the Zeagle Razor setup. Also, I hear very different things as to whether a 19 cu-ft Pony bottle is sufficient or not, but I really would try to not go up in size unless there is a vital reason. Any experiences will be greatly appreciated.

here would be assumptions I'd make -

* You are a photographer who primarily intends to fly to resort dive operations to dive by yourself
* You are not going real deep, because of the loss of ambient light
* You're not swimming huge distances, but instead you're taking photos in fairly confined areas
* You've got a pretty large camera/housing unit and flash attachments to deal with in terms of dropping into the water and getting back onto the boat

These are a coupla thoughts you might consider -

* An aluminum 19 would probably be all the air you'd reasonably need (given the assumptions above)
* With units like the Razor or other little 6cuft tanks with integrated second stages you bring the unit to your mouth. That is, you need a hand to get at the unit and detach it from wherever its dangling and bring it up to your mouth.
* Since you already have both hands full of camera and strobes, slinging a bottle may indeed be a PITA.
* Attaching the 19 to your rental tank may make sense for you - using one of the quick release clamps. Bottle is out of your way for shooting and comparatively rigid for both the drops as well as climbing the ladder back onto the boat.
* The 'bottle on the back' approach means you'll need a standard reg coming over your right shoulder. You might want to look at using a necklace for it. This would be an efficient way of 'leaving the unit in place' and only needing to pop the second stage into your mouth in the event of a gas issue.
* One big deal is being able to reach the tank valve. No matter where or how you place the unit, being able to turn it on and off is important (IMHO). Make sure you can reach and manipulate the valve. In fact, being able to reach and manipulate the valve may drive where you locate the unit.

For a macro-photographer who is likely diving in 40'-60' of water, and who at the end of the dive hasn't moved more than 15'-20' from where you started the dive, this makes sense. Your needs and circumstances might be much different from other divers with more rigorous profiles.

I can't think of any advantages to the smaller units that are not trumped by the 19 cu ft tank. As with all things, your mileage may vary.

Regards,

Doc

 

[AbyssalPlains]

Thanks to all for these incredibly helpful suggestions! It sounds as if the need for reaching and manipulating the valve is something I should be very aware of. I guess that basically kills the Razor because that system has a tiny valve that may be difficult to manipulate. However, in the course of the discussion about leaving the tank turned off during the dive, two questions popped up in my head:

Is it realistic to assume that in an emergency situation I will have the presence of mind to reach back, fumble for the valve, open it, then locate my second stage and stick it into my mouth? Or is it more realistic that I want my air to be turned on the whole time at the risk of having to monitor two gauges for air supply?

Second, and this may be a stupid question: If I leave my pony turned off during the dive, doesn't this result in water entering the second stage and causing all sorts of mayhem?

 

[texdiveguy]

Second, and this may be a stupid question: If I leave my pony turned off during the dive, doesn't this result in water entering the second stage and causing all sorts of mayhem?

The bottle is 'charged' prior to the decent...this prevents water from entering the 1st stage/bottle....during the dive you will occasionally 'feather' the valve on and then off to ensure the system stays charged. Some recreational divers prefer leaving the pony bottle on all during the dive.