PBS Show on Cave Diving

[Doc Intrepid]

Since you brought this up I'd be interested to know for those who don't subscribe to the DIR principles, how you approach the diving. While I like a lot of the DIR stuff, and to me a lot of it makes sense, it is clearly not the only way to dive technically.

I'd be quite grateful to hear some other thoughts on the subject if not for the purposes of open discussion, at least for my own benefit. If you feel this would be better handled privately, we could take it to PM, but the conversation might benefit others as well.

Thanks

Subject for a different thread...

 

[jetfixer]

Okay, so you're saying that these folks go into an unknown underground spring/cavern, max. depths of somewhere around 200-300 ft., squeeze into openings barely larger than their butts, and somehow manage to stay alive and not get DCI.

Aw c'mon Jim, I've seen you squeeze into the crevice at shaw's!

 

[OneBrightGator]

At one point they come to an opening that is so tight they need to remove their side-mounted tanks, feed them through first, then wiggle thru the opening. All the while kicking up lots of silt.

Since all your questions were answered, I have one for you: Did they have video footage of the divers actually going through the restriction and from both sides?

 

[mccabejc]

Gator,
Yes they did, which floored me. As in most of these "extreme adventure" shows, the one who really deserves the credit is the cameraman. Unbelievable.

 

[mccabejc]

Aw c'mon Jim, I've seen you squeeze into the crevice at shaw's!

Dude, I was trying to be humble !!!!

Anyway, I figure that some of the shots must be staged. For example, it's hard to believe that first the cameraman squeezes his equipment and himself thru this tiny opening (all the while kicking up clouds of silt), and then they have to wait for the silt to settle before getting a nice clear shot of a diver coming thru ??? I don't think so. They must get the shots at another location, in an opening which is easily accessible from either side.

This whole thing just blows my mind.

 

[OneBrightGator]

Good job, remember, it's TV first, cave diving... well, probably not even second

When you want to find out what 99% of real cave divers do, hop a flight and take a Cavern class, it'll change your diving.

 

[MikeFerrara]

Dude, I was trying to be humble !!!!

Anyway, I figure that some of the shots must be staged. For example, it's hard to believe that first the cameraman squeezes his equipment and himself thru this tiny opening (all the while kicking up clouds of silt), and then they have to wait for the silt to settle before getting a nice clear shot of a diver coming thru ??? I don't think so. They must get the shots at another location, in an opening which is easily accessible from either side.

This whole thing just blows my mind.

What show was it and what cave system. In a cave with some flow the silt can clear in seconds.

rebreathers...

All the factory built rebreathers that I know of are way too huge for small caves. That's where side mount comes in.

300 ft cave dives...not too rare these days. Guys are doing it about every week in Missouri, Eagles Nest and Dipolder...not to 1900 ft penetration but the depth is sure there.

radios used in cave survey...most of the units I've seen used including the one Skiles uses were designed and or built by Brian Peace. His equipment was also used for the radio mapping at Peacock Springs and an early version was used in the Wakulla 2 project. The voice coms that Wes Skiles uses are also Brians. It works because it's real radio as apposed to ultrasonics like most Uw voice coms. I had the privilage of being present when it was used at a private site in Kentucky. That was kind of neat. They had a couple thousand feet of flooded cave, a couple thousand of dry cave and then more flooded cave and then more dry cave. Not very deep but if you fall and break a leg carrying dive gear while climbing over slippery bolders 10000 feet back in a cave behind a sump you're in for a real bad day. The entire thing was staked out on the surface and each station accurately mapped using GPS.

Jason Gully had a set built and has used it to survey a few places including Vortex...something for the owners. There's a video but I haven't senen it on PBS LOL. Some of the video was taken during the actal survey but some special video dives were done to get more. The biggest reason that was done is just because of limited time and other things that need to be done. The divers doing the survey were also doing the video and some dives were just too busy. Seperate dives had to be done to get the setup/support divers on film because they usually weren't in the water at the same time as the cammera.

 

[lamont]

No. You still have a 200 ft water column above you.

assuming hydrostatic equilibrium, technically you have a 200 ft water column behind you which you are at equilibrium with. presumably you could have funky effects due to currents and hydrodynamics (e.g. venturi effects), but i haven't heard of them (?).

 

[Maya]

Dude, I was trying to be humble !!!!

Anyway, I figure that some of the shots must be staged. For example, it's hard to believe that first the cameraman squeezes his equipment and himself thru this tiny opening (all the while kicking up clouds of silt), and then they have to wait for the silt to settle before getting a nice clear shot of a diver coming thru ??? I don't think so. They must get the shots at another location, in an opening which is easily accessible from either side.

This whole thing just blows my mind.

I think one of the films you are referring to is Water's Journey (the movie where the divers are being tracked on the surface). The scene where Jill and Tom squeeze through the tight spot while the current is raging was not staged, it was a completely accurate view of actual conditions. The footage in that movie was shot at many different locations around Florida. It was not easy getting the cameral through that area, but it was accomplished!

 

[scububa]

Okay, so you're saying that these folks go into an unknown underground spring/cavern, max. depths of somewhere around 200-300 ft., squeeze into openings barely larger than their butts, and somehow manage to stay alive and not get DCI.

You gotta be kiddin' me.

By the way, what's a "WKPP", and what's a "19,000 foot push"? Was that the guys in Florida with the radios and stuff?

It is often called "exploration". If you come back, you are called an Explorer, if you don't, you are called a fool. I bet Shackelton, Perry, Cousteau, Glenn, Lovell... heard a lot of "you gotta be kiddin me". I know that's what I thought the first time I looked in a Gemini capsule.