PADI Police in force

[TCDiver1]

That said, if you show up with 32% for a charter that's been planned to something at 125' you've got two choices: watch bubbles or wave from the dock.

Or accept a higher ppO for that dive.

I agree though, it really is incumbent on the dive op to inform customers what the dive plan is to assure all customers feel comfortable with the plan before they pay.

Most of us have been on both sides of this issue and it sucks whenever you don't get what you're expecting and paid for. Good customer service will strive to accommodate all paying customers or communicate that they can't prior to accepting payment.

Incidentally, i really like your slogan: "We dive alone, together."

 

[FritzCat66]

Jupiter, Florida, has some deep reefs in the 60'-90' range and the boats generally allow plain OW certifications for that, but at least one of the ops requires AOW minimum for a 130' "hole in the wall" swimthru dive - even though plain OW is supposed to be only up to 60' and AOW is only to 100' and technically you're supposed to need Deep Diver for the 130' rec limit. Yet this op (Jupiter Dive Center) is a "PADI 5-Star Dive Center", so I doubt the DM's concern from the original post was really a PADI issue.

Not to question his judgement, though - he may have had less-tangible reasons not to go to depth with that diver and simply used the PADI rules as a convenient way out. I just doubt it actually had any concern with the "PADI Police".

Most divers with AOW should be fine to 130', although I went ahead and got Deep just so I could dive to recreational limits without ever being accused of "diving beyond my certification". However, I can't really say I learned much from the Deep course that I didn't already learn in AOW.

My "comfort zone" remains 100' or less. That one extra atmosphere of pressure beyond may still be within recreational limits, but it sure does suck the gas out of a tank in a fat hurry and pushes a lot of nitrogen into your system as well. I rarely find the greatly shortened dive time and N2 absorption to be worth seeing whatever is at that depth. Besides, the available light to see the beautiful reef colors is soooo much better at shallower depths!

For what it's worth, my OW and AOW were under PADI, while Deep was with SSI.

 

[boulderjohn]

Over the years I have been guilty of misreading a post and responding inappropriately more than a few times. I think that has happened in this thread several times, and it may be confusing some readers. Several people seem to think that it was the DM who made the initial ruling that the site was inappropriate.

I think that a DM is no different than any other diver when it comes to calling a dive. You can call a dive for any reason, at any time. If the DM had a bad feeling about this dive, then he was right to follow his gut and call the dive. Too many people get pressured into making dives when they shouldn't, and putting themselves, their buddy, and others in harms way.

On the same logic, I don't see any problems with a DM, someone who holds insurance and potental liability for a diver, making the same decision for his own reasons. What I do have a problem with is the boat changing its plans to accomodate the zealotry of a single DM.

...so I doubt the DM's concern from the original post was really a PADI issue.

Not to question his judgement, though - he may have had less-tangible reasons not to go to depth with that diver and simply used the PADI rules as a convenient way out. I just doubt it actually had any concern with the "PADI Police".

A review of the OP indicates that it was a customer who objected to the dive site the DM had selected and raised such a ruckus over it that the DM was pushed to change to a less desirable site.

I went diving off a boat in California recently and a customer got into an arugment
with the newer dive master because his buddy was an open water diver with 36 dives and the max depth was set at 80 ft for the dive. He said that's unsafe, against PADI rules, and wouldn't dive with his buddy to that depth....
...
Because of this one guy we changed our dive site to a less exciting and shallower dive becasue the DM was worried about getting in trouble with PADI.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I have canceled trips when the op changed sites to accomodate one or two people. Happened in the keys. Scheduled to do the duane with about 6 other people. 4 OW divers showed up and wanted to dive but the Duane is an AOW dive. Op changed plan- I changed op. If someone shows up with the wrong gas for the dive and everyone else is good to go changing the site to accomodate one or two people is just plain ignorant and rude. PLanning begins when you decide to dive. Don't screw over other people by assuming anything. Find out the site and mix accordingly or stay home.

 

[alibi 2]

In Monterey the dive boats often anchor at pinnacle sites that offer a max. depth of 80 but will start around 40-50. If this was the case the new diver could keep his depth where he felt comfortable. If he was a beginner that had a depth he didnt want to go past he should have let the boat know and arranged a beginner boat dive. It is not right to turn back a whole boat because of one diver. It is better to let the one diver sit out any dives he is uncomfortable with and let the others dive the dive then move to a beginner site for the second dive or just give the newbie a raincheck and set him up on a beginning dive trip.

 

[TMHeimer]

I've done a modest number of charters, in Nova Scotia, Florida, and one in Texas. On each occasion, all aboard knew exactly what the max depths were to be. I assumed this was almost always the case- am I wrong? I guess something strange could happen to change the site. If the diver was not comfortable with the deeper depth and knew about it beforehand, why was he on the boat? I must've missed something.

 

[tracydr]

Jim, from your previous postings i get the impression that you take training/certifying divers seriously. I can assure you that we practiced no skills on my aow dives, and the classroom was nothing more than a slideshow of the book. We did 3 drift dives on a reef that was impossible to get lost on (for navigation) one time my wife held the dive buoy and another time I held it... I was told this meant we "led" the dive and that was required for the cert. The deep dive was in 6-8 ft seas and was 115'. I did learn a lot from that dive... I learned what it is like to have co2 buildup due to exertion that leads to a feeling of unease... I learned that it is better to get separated from the group than try to keep up and exert yourself... Neither of these were learned due to being in the class, just from being on the dive. (I learned about co2 from SB after the fact). I can assure you that just because the agency is naui that doesn't mean that the instructor is a good one. (I am nitrox certified from naui too and that class was worse... The instructor couldn't explain some things and my wife and I actually defined a couple of words for him that were in the presentation...not to mention he skipped some slides). These experiences don't bother me that much, but it did teach me to be more selective when picking instructors for rescue and beyond.

You should repeat AOW or do GUE fun dies with a reallly good instructor. Mine taught me a bunch, even though I'd already had 150 dives in a bunch of challenging environments. I'm planning on doing GUE classes as soon as I can get to CA for them.