New Apple Watch is a dive computer

[Rick Brant]

My watch is behaving fine now. Those first four logged dives are no good but two dives since are fine. Not sure what was going on there but hopefully it was temporary. I do think day-pass users will struggle to work things out in a single day.

 

[ThatDogDontHunt]

They won't fix it in the app if the limitation is the pressure sensor, which everything seems to indicate.

Since this isn't a dedicated dive computer they will have gone with the smallest possible sensor they could use, because every cubic micrometer of space in that watch counts for something. Just googling what could potentially have gone into it, here's a couple of ST Microlectronics pressure sensors for wearables which go to 4 ATA (Pressure Sensors - STMicroelectronics). Apparently they used something a little bit better, but I don't know why people find it incredible that it's a sensor limit at 5 ATA.

I bet there's a product manager at Apple who happily made a tradeoff to save a little bit of space and a dollar on the BOM by using a sensor that "only" works in the recreational depths.

It will be interesting to learn the real reason for the seemingly strange limitation.

- Is it a legal thing? target == rec divers -> beyond 140 feet there be dragons?
- is it a pressure sensor thing?
- is it a "the watch is really not as water resistant as the marketing leads people to think"? i.e. it leaks somewhere just below 140 feet?

What is this ISO 22810:2010 standard?

The Apple Watch Series 2 has a water resistance rating of 50 meters under ISO 22810:2010. 50 meters. Well below rec diving limits. Deeper than the Apple Watch 8 Ultra apparent limit.

So: Can you scuba with a Series 2. Nope. What? Why not?

"Apple Watch Series 2 and later can be used for shallow-water activities like swimming in a pool or ocean, but you shouldn't use models other than Apple Watch Ultra for diving, water skiing, or other activities involving submersion below shallow depth or high-velocity water."

So ISO 22810:2010 50 Meters means you can swim with it. But not scuba. Not water ski. Not anything beyond a "shallow depth". 50 meters is not 50 meters?

Seems like the "labels" from ISO 22810:2010 are misleading? If you can not rec scuba with a 50 Meter rating, what does the 100 Meter rating really mean?

About Apple Watch water resistance - Apple Support

Learn about water resistance on your Apple Watch and what to do if your device gets wet.

support.apple.com

 

[jborg]

It means the same thing it's always meant for water resistant watches, seriously, come on. This cannot be news to anyone who've ever seen a dinky little digital watch with a "50m" or "100m" rating.

Degree of Water Resistance | CASIO

Information about CASIO's watches & clocks.

www.casio-intl.com

Or google "what does water resistant to 50 m mean" for literally one hundred takes on this, from like the seventies and onwards.

Also note that ISO 2281 is specifically for non-diving watches, while testing of dive watches is covered under ISO 6425.

 

[ThatDogDontHunt]

It means the same thing it's always meant for water resistant watches, seriously, come on. This cannot be news to anyone who've ever seen a dinky little digital watch with a "50m" or "100m" rating.

Degree of Water Resistance | CASIO

Information about CASIO's watches & clocks.

www.casio-intl.com

Or google "what does water resistant to 50 m mean" for literally one hundred takes on this, from like the seventies and onwards.

Also note that ISO 2281 is specifically for non-diving watches, while testing of dive watches is covered under ISO 6425.

Interesting. Casio claims

"100M Water Resistance: Wearable around sinks, during swimming, poolside diving, snorkeling, but not while jet-skiing or scuba diving"

 

[Craine]

Saw an interesting tidbit from an article in Gear Patrol. I have no idea who the author is or if they are making wild claims, but if they are close to the mark, it’d be a pretty great addition for Apple/Huish (and potentially other vendors) to unlock later, especially if it uses the existing Pelagic Pressure Systems transmitters out there.

In a nutshell: gas gauge integration. Modern dive computers can accept signals from monitors in our regulators that will put gas levels on the wrist. I pressed Huish on this point, maybe a little too hard as we edged up on the realm of non-disclosure agreements I hadn't signed. I don't know if the Ultra can accept the specialized signals that gas monitors send to dive computers, but I got the sense that we will find out soon enough.

 

[Ryebrye]

Saw an interesting tidbit from an article in Gear Patrol. I have no idea who the author is or if they are making wild claims, but if they are close to the mark, it’d be a pretty great addition for Apple/Huish (and potentially other vendors) to unlock later, especially if it uses the existing Pelagic Pressure Systems transmitters out there.

That's probably one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read.

Please explain to me how, specifically, they are going to add air integration to this device when it has no sensor to receive it?

 

[Craine]

That's probably one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read.

Please explain to me how, specifically, they are going to add air integration to this device when it has no sensor to receive it?

I mean, I wasn’t involved in the hardware development of the Ultra (or, you know, any other Apple product), so I wouldn’t know whether or not it actually does or doesn’t have a PPS receiver built in.

What I do know is that Apple, and many other companies for that matter, have a history of including hardware needed for future features that are locked away/not available to developers for use until the hardware manufacturer decides. It is entirely within the realm of possibility that they included the receiver on their SIP, and just haven’t opened it’s APIs to the developers.

 

[Rick Brant]

I know some air integration communications is done using sound. If that is the case then the microphone is already in the Watch.

 

[seba76]

I mean, I wasn’t involved in the hardware development of the Ultra (or, you know, any other Apple product), so I wouldn’t know whether or not it actually does or doesn’t have a PPS receiver built in.

What I do know is that Apple, and many other companies for that matter, have a history of including hardware needed for future features that are locked away/not available to developers for use until the hardware manufacturer decides. It is entirely within the realm of possibility that they included the receiver on their SIP, and just haven’t opened its APIs to the developers.

I guess if the watch was really equipped with a PPS receiver, we should see it during the FCC certification. Now as mentioned above they may use another communication protocol.

 

[ThatDogDontHunt]

I mean, I wasn’t involved in the hardware development of the Ultra (or, you know, any other Apple product), so I wouldn’t know whether or not it actually does or doesn’t have a PPS receiver built in.

What I do know is that Apple, and many other companies for that matter, have a history of including hardware needed for future features that are locked away/not available to developers for use until the hardware manufacturer decides. It is entirely within the realm of possibility that they included the receiver on their SIP, and just haven’t opened it’s APIs to the developers.

Based on the Teric and Garmin Descent we know that it is possible to jam the required circuitry into a watch sized dive computer.

It would be interesting for someone with more knowledge to comment on the chance of that hw being in place with respect to it potentially being very special purpose.

The Apple Watch Ultra was not designed as a dive computer. It was designed as a smart watch. I suggest they later figured out they could make a hamstrung dive computer with restricted depth limits using the existing general purpose smart watch hardware.

If the AI receiver requires special hardware it would be very surprising if it was designed in.

In my limited experience we did attempt to design in future features, but never populated the hw due to cost savings. Shaving 50 cents off of a million units gets the bean counters attention real fast.