Nekton boats may come back!!

[tarponchik]

The rich that are still rich enough to not be effected by the economy are not Aggressor's customers. They charter a yacht to go wherever they like. The folks who want to drive to Ft. Lauderdale to get on the boat are not saving a few bucks on plane tickets, they want to bring more gear than they can fit on an airplane. With the drastic demise in the quality of air service, I think that there will be a resurgence of the customers that a boat leaving for the Bahamas from Ft. Lauderdale would attract. The avid photographers/vidoegraphers, and rebreather divers...

No, not that rich. Rich like making >$500,000/year rich, but no Bill Gates kind of rich.

As for the avid photographers with truckloads of stuff, how many are there? So far, I met just one, on Dominica. He is a pro who's trips are paid by magasines and advertising agencies. If his stuff is lost he does not care cause it is all insured. The rest of the guys I met carried nothing but one DSLR/housing/couple of lenses/couple of strobes. Their stuff fits into carry-ons. Most of American airlines are still pretty generous with carry-ons; you can take a 45" bag into AA flight for example (compare to just 22" into Air France). I'm sure you see a lot more divers than I do, of course.

Also, not only the quality of air service went down--airfare went up significantly compared with the 90s, and keep on growing, according to this source: American Express Business Travel said "overall airfares increased substantially" in the fi

 

[mike_s]

It's not just the airfare. it's all the other crap that goes with it.

airfare went up, but now they charge you $25 to $50 bucks for your first checked bag on some airlines, and $50+ for your second.

If you've got photo gear, and dive gear, and clothes, that can easily run 3 checked bags. And since people often go as couples or groups on liveboard trips, double all those fees. So it all adds up.


Then take what the local airports screw you with when you get there. When I went on the Ultimate Getaway 2 summers ago, it was $70 for a cab ride from the airport to the boat for 1-4 people. For 5 people (we had 5) it was $90 bucks. Why? because the airport set the fares and had only one monopoly cab company "licensed" to take cab customers from the airport.

Take stupid fees, baggage fees, airport hassles, airline ticket fees, etc.... and then add that they don't want their gear lost or stolen by the airlines, THAT is why they want to drive down.

 

[tarponchik]

It is partly a question of size. The smaller the resort and the more remote the location, the more likely they are to have a strict cancellation/refund policy. But I've never heard of one telling you can't come because they don't have enough guests. Of course one big difference is they don't have the fuel cost of a liveaboard.

I understand that, and I am not insisting that they should operate even if they are losing money, having just a couple of divers on board. But I'd like to have the same right to cancel, on a reasonable note, as they have.

 

[tarponchik]

It's not just the airfare. it's all the other crap that goes with it.

So your vote is for Fort Lauderdale, just like mine? ;-))

 

[Darnold9999]

Yes, you do have a contract. This is what the Aggressor's says on the subject:



So "not getting enough paying guests" is reason enough to cancel, according to this particular contract. I would be surprised if other liveaboards don't have a similar clause in theirs. Whether it makes good business sense to cancel is a separate question.

Agree and if I were to book Agressor I know that that is their policy and will ask how many people on the boat and how many they need to fill the charter AND then tell them to give me a call when they have enough people.

I am not booking the flight until I know the boat is going to go out. One of the reasons I liked Nekton. I could have a conversation with the agent and find out how many were currently booked and believe them. They would say we might have to cancel if we don't get x number more divers. Never happened and I did go out on a trip with a very small number of divers but they were up front with me (that was when Pam was booking)

If you are up front then I get to make the decision, if you are not then you get to eat the costs. If you lie to me and tell me that the boat has enough divers to go out then we have a fight on our hands if you subsequently cancel.

 

[ronaldo fleury]

ronaldo, the problem with that is these SWATH boats are pigs to drive around... at 8.5 MPH (7 kn) they burn truck loads of fuel and consume another valuable resource on charters: crew sleep hours. Everyone likes to say "they are the crew; it's their job!" but, realistically speaking, they are still human. There are only so many hours in a day and when you consume the crew doing long transits, there is significant decrease in alertness during dive operations. While the whole crew does not have to be up for the entire transit, enough have to be awake for evolutions such as anchoring or mooring that it impacts who the bright eyed and bushytailed happy dive guides are in the morning. Also, despite "only" requiring the crew to get up for the evolution still interrupts their sleep-wake patterns and causes much more than the 1 hour of work.

All in all, reduced travelling by the boat benefits all involved:
lower fuel cost = lower charter cost
less wear on vessel= lower maintenance requirement
Less demand on nocturnal crew= less burnout and turn-over.

These Swath boats would be ideal in some off the beaten path nickel sized island chain where there is awe-inspiring diving only 5 miles from an airport with an accessible dock. An hour or two repositioning is functional. 10 hour overnight 'jaunts' thats when you start to have crewing issues. If you have to allot more crew to the carter, to compensate for this increased demand, then your wages go up and the per man gratuity split goes down. I have worked under both conditions: 4-5 man crew and 10 man crew on fungible sized boats. I tell you that the crew is much more willing to put out for a 500-600 tip envelope each man than for a diluted 175-300. But that willing and eager equates to faster burnout. It really is a fine art to find the happy median, and that is one small detail that contributes to making or breaking a crew. As Frank (wookie) said earlier, the crew makes or breaks the boat.


BTW as someone who has worked charters both in diving industry and Luxury Yachts, I am willing to say based on the posts Wookie has made which I have read, HE strikes me very much a Captain I would actually enjoy working under. Almost enough to wish I was American even :mooner: .That guttural reaction in my mind lends credence to much of his advice to the OP...

Tregrrr,
I'm prosecutor in Brazil and I'm specialized in labor law. It means that I never could think as "they are the crew; it's their job!", because my job is to defend the workers. I just make the suggestion because one of the things that attracted me a lot to dive with Nekton was the fact that I can arrive in Miami from Brazil and go directly to the boat. As I had the experience in Australia and, of course, I payed for the fly, I thought it could help. But, as you wrote, the distances in Bahamas are pretty larger than in Australia and could not be possible.
The only thing that I want is to have the opportunity to dive again with the Nekton that I really liked.
Ronaldo

 

[mike_s]

So your vote is for Fort Lauderdale, just like mine? ;-))

I don't know if any of us have a "vote" in it. All we can do is say what our preferences are.

I think folks could care less if it's Miami, Ft Lauderdale, or West Palm for instance.... they just like being able to drive to the boat.

It's being in Nassau or Grand Bahama just means extra $$$ in airfare. Regardless of where you are. I don't see them moving to smaller islands just because the flights aren't there to support getting customers there w/o extra hops.

 

[Dsix36]

I have only been on one liveaboard. It happened to be the Nekton Pilot and only because it was in Fort Lauderdale. I could drive there easily, without having to fly anywhere.

I would go again without hesitation.

 

[diverdoug1]

So Deepdiver4U, it seems like the votes are in. If you want to cash in on any remaining Good Nekton karma, you will need the leave out of Florida, and if not leave elsewhere.

 

[diverdoug1]

No, not that rich. Rich like making >$500,000/year rich, but no Bill Gates kind of rich.

As for the avid photographers with truckloads of stuff, how many are there? So far, I met just one, on Dominica. He is a pro who's trips are paid by magasines and advertising agencies. If his stuff is lost he does not care cause it is all insured. The rest of the guys I met carried nothing but one DSLR/housing/couple of lenses/couple of strobes. Their stuff fits into carry-ons. Most of American airlines are still pretty generous with carry-ons; you can take a 45" bag into AA flight for example (compare to just 22" into Air France). I'm sure you see a lot more divers than I do, of course.

Also, not only the quality of air service went down--airfare went up significantly compared with the 90s, and keep on growing, according to this source: American Express Business Travel said "overall airfares increased substantially" in the fi

Not true, I am in the >500,000 category, and do lots of trips with Aggressor/ Aquacat ect. If I booked private yachts, I would only be able to do a couple of trips a year, I now dow at least 5 liveaboard trips a year.