Need advice on whether to take legal action!

[JadeNorth92]

I'm writing to gain any information I can to figure out what triggered my father to pass away at sea two months ago today at Ras Mohammed international park Egypt!
he was a very experienced diver with 50-100 dives completed not to imagine this was going to be his last dive, he was surfacing after a 40min dive (according to his dive watch) and arose very quickly from around 11metres, after a biopsy we discovered that Pneumothorax was not his cause of death, so a further investigation on my behave starts there... he was blue when he surfaced the water which indicates he had lack of oxygen in his blood so what I would like to know is what could have gone wrong with his tank or BCG? im not very good with the scuba lingo so im not sure if all of the words im using are correct so apologies if im wrong, once my dad surfaced, the dive team on the boat had no first aid qualification and had no idea about CPR, as they compressed his chest whilst he was still drowning on the water he had swallowed? ARE THEY STUPID? so forums like this are great! its just unfortunate that my dad didn't sign up to one like this sooner, or maybe he did, im still unsure! any comments will be so much help and im not sure what action to take and whether I should let it go or investigate further, P.S other suspicious things happened on this trip after he had passed such as his dive log paperwork with his previous dives on had been torn out of his PADI log book, his rented oxygen tank was nowhere to be found and his medical forms were forged by a member of the dive team, im not out to blame anyone, its just comforting to talk to people who know what could of of may have happened, look forward to any replies... thanks! x

 

[Tigerman]

Im sorry for your loss.
It sounds like you would, most places, have a cause for legal action if the things about the lack of first aid training, his log book, tank and medical form where correct - but Egypt is a country that is in a bit of a mess at the moment..
Somewhere between 50 and 100 dives is not all that experienced though - although numbers alone dont say all about experience.

 

[Ste Wart]

the dive team on the boat had no first aid qualification and had no idea about CPR,

Actually this is impossible.

The likelihood is all the 'Dive team' were PADI divemasters or above. Which means they would have had CPR and 1st Aid training. There is a chance they were from another agency that does not require this, but for the life of me I couldn't name one.

Possibly none of the staff were even qualified Divemasters, but in that instance they would need to be lower than Advanced Open Water divers to stand the possiblility of not having a 1st Aid cert. This is highly unlikely.

Get the name of the Shop and any staff involved and report it to PADI EMEA in Bristol. Also email the Egyptian Chamber of Watersport & Diving (CDWS) assuming they are still responsible for safety.

 

[Tigerman]

Actually this is impossible.

The likelihood is all the 'Dive team' were PADI divemasters or above. Which means they would have had CPR and 1st Aid training. There is a chance they were from another agency that does not require this, but for the life of me I couldn't name one.

Possibly none of the staff were even qualified Divemasters, but in that instance they would need to be lower than Advanced Open Water divers to stand the possiblility of not having a 1st Aid cert. This is highly unlikely.

Get the name of the Shop and any staff involved and report it to PADI EMEA in Bristol. Also email the Egyptian Chamber of Watersport & Diving (CDWS) assuming they are still responsible for safety.

There is the possibility that this was an in-house dive "op" from a certain part of the world that dont care about any training standards whatsoever..

 

[JadeNorth92]

I guess the team maybe were/are qualified for first aid but didn't want to act on this occasion...
thanks for the advice on the two places to contact though, I will be emailing the Egyptian chamber and will report the name of the instructors and dive school to PADI EMEA in Bristol! Thankyou

 

[lv2dive]

Jade, first of all - I am very sorry for your loss. I can not imagine what you are going through.

Secondly - I would ask you what are you trying to accomplish with this potential lawsuit? Because your reasons could potentially skew people's answers. If your answer is something along the lines of "I believe they were negligent and I want them to hold them accountable (read: make them pay) so they do not do again" then answers may go in one direction. If your answer is more along the lines of "I want to find out what happened" then the answers may go in another direction. If your answer is something else, or a combination of any of the above.... you get the idea.

I bring this up for two reasons. A - I am not sure you will accomplish the first or the second goal mentioned above with any sort of legal action/lawsuit. B - Most people who are involved in lawsuits - even when they win - will tell you they are huge drains emotionally, mentally, financially, etc. Would the price you end up paying be worth potentially not getting your goals met?

If I were in your shoes, I would be crystal clear about what I was hoping to accomplish, and then make sure it is something that is in fact obtainable in that area of the world, before I moved forward with even thinking about any legal action.

Just my 2 cents. Again, my condolences on the loss of your father.

 

[DevonDiver]

he was surfacing after a 40min dive (according to his dive watch) and arose very quickly from around 11metres, after a biopsy we discovered that Pneumothorax was not his cause of death, so a further investigation on my behave starts there...

What other information arose from the biopsy (autopsy?). There should have been obvious signs of DCI, contamination (carbon monoxide poisoning etc) or hypoxia if present.

he was blue when he surfaced the water which indicates he had lack of oxygen in his blood so what I would like to know is what could have gone wrong with his tank or BCG?

Blue skin (cyanosis) indicates several potential medical issues, including drowning, carbon monoxide poisoning.... or an unrelated (to scuba) medical event; such as a heart attack.

the dive team on the boat had no first aid qualification and had no idea about CPR,..

As others have mentioned, this is unlikely, but can be confirmed.

... they compressed his chest whilst he was still drowning on the water he had swallowed? ARE THEY STUPID?

CPR is the correct first aid to be given to a drowned victim, or for any instance where cardiac/respiratory cessation is suspected. There is nothing stupid in that.

Drowning Treatment: First Aid Information for Drowning

his dive log paperwork with his previous dives on had been torn out of his PADI log book,

This is unusual, but I'm not sure how that action would benefit the dive operation concerned.

Did the dive log accompany your father to medical treatment? It's normal to send evidence of previous dives (within the immediate timescale) along with the victim as they may be used to diagnose issues and/or formulate treatment (especially hyperbaric treatment). Could it be that medical staff removed pertinent info at the time?

his rented oxygen tank was nowhere to be found

In many developed countries, it is standard practice to preserve, untouched, the victim's scuba equipment for investigation. That is not likely to be the case in less developed nations. Preservation of equipment for subsequent investigation is not a priority during rescue/first-aid situations either.

his medical forms were forged by a member of the dive team

Medical forms are normally only completed for scuba diving courses, not 'fun' (guided) diving. The dive center would not be expected to have medical forms (self-declaration and/or doctor's authorization) for any diver unless they were on a training course. There should be no reason for them to fake such documents.

Are you aware of any medical conditions that your father may have suffered from?

The list/form containing relevant issues is here: PADI Medical Statement

As a qualified diver, your father had been educated to seek medical advice before diving, if unwell, sick or taking prescribed medications.

 

[JadeNorth92]

thanks for everyones information, im beginning to understand how everything must of happened, not being at the incident obviously leaves us in the dark and only lets us rely on the whitnesses that were there that day to tell us what happened, I do not wish to sue anybody or get any body into trouble I just hope that this particular dive centre will be re-established or closed so that it doesn't happen to anyone else, and im aware that there if probably a lot more dive schools like this and its bound to have happened before, it just feels awful to not do anything god forbid this every happens again, id feel terrible and would just like to share what has happened in my case to raise awareness about it because its a terrible incident that could of easily been solved if there was avalible first aid, like someone said above, it could of been an unsubscribed dive club that arnt PADI trained, although I did go on the CDWS website and the school seems to be running still and they are on the website, but not on the black list, all my intentions are is to get a better understanding of how it could of happened as I cant exsactly ask my dad! and for it never to happen to anyone else.

---------- Post added April 22nd, 2013 at 12:46 PM ----------

P.S im aware that he should have thought twice about diving with minor heart conditions, this still doesn't make up for the fact there was no available first aider, or for the team to try and cover their backs in case they were liable.

 

[Ste Wart]

There is the possibility that this was an in-house dive "op" from a certain part of the world that dont care about any training standards whatsoever..

Ras Mohammed is in Egypt. Do you think it was somewhere else?

You need a CDWS card (or did) to leave the port in Sharm. So someone was qualified or shall we say instead had an EFR cert, which may or may not be the same thing.

 

[Tigerman]

Ras Mohammed is in Egypt. Do you think it was somewhere else?

You need a CDWS card (or did) to leave the port in Sharm. So someone was qualified or shall we say instead had an EFR cert, which may or may not be the same thing.

No, I do not. But I do know there is dive ops whos management and staff is from a different part of the world and that they are NOT following local regulations AT ALL.

Theres also a word down there used in a couple of different manners - baksheesh..