Near miss with an experienced diver

[uncfnp]

^^This. I've done negative entries before in Coz. I didn't understand their need, why didn't the boat just head a few hundred yards up current and allow us to splash, as a group, with some air in our BC's?

It is always interesting to see the various styles and procedures of individual divers. I have no problem with negative entries. In fact I rarely hang out on the surface on any dive. Short of air off or not enough weight, I can think of few problems that can’t be taken care of at depth as easily as on the surface. Some, like bubbles from a leak, will not be obvious until submerged.

Part of this is probably experience, I have been diving long enough to know my weight. And knowing and maintaining your own gear so you are intimately comfortable with it. Plus checking your rig throughly and several breaths before splashing.

Also experience gives me an advantage to deal with issues at depth. Knock on waves, I have never yet had to return to the boat early to deal with a gear problem. I have had on occassion to get some help from a fellow diver/buddy.

As to need, I am no boat Captain, but it seems reasonable that the further upsteam from your target, the more likely to get push off it and miss it completely, espcially if you are unfamiliar with the dive, reduced viz or no easy landmarks. And floating on the surface may well carry you off target.

 

[Bob DBF]

My instructor really emphasizes 1. Also that you should take a couple test breaths to make sure the needle stays up, even if the pressure gauge says fulls. I give my instructor lots of props for being very safety focused.

Did he also inform you that you can get this indication if the valve is only partially open, depending on the valve 1/4 turn open possibly less. It will starve you for air as you go deeper, not nearly as bad as a closed valve, but harder to diagnose if you don't know it can happen.


Bob

 

[yle]

Edit: was going to comment that the OOA exercise is part of PADI OW confined water; then I found it's already been covered. Carry on...

 

[yle]

It is always interesting to see the various styles and procedures of individual divers. I have no problem with negative entries. In fact I rarely hang out on the surface on any dive. Short of air off or not enough weight, I can think of few problems that can’t be taken care of at depth as easily as on the surface. Some, like bubbles from a leak, will not be obvious until submerged.

Part of this is probably experience, I have been diving long enough to know my weight. And knowing and maintaining your own gear so you are intimately comfortable with it. Plus checking your rig throughly and several breaths before splashing.

I'm with you on this, although buddy separation can be an issue with negative entries.

 

[yle]

I could theoretically practice it though on land when I've completed a dive now, because I have my own tank that I could breathe empty.

You don't need to breathe your tank to empty... it would take a while and it's not good for the tank. Just turn the tank on, breathe from it, turn the valve off, keep breathing (or try to.)

 

[Ana]

I admit it is just terrifying to me to think of trying to breathe on a reg and not being able to get anything out. I wonder if there is any value to practicing in a pool or even on land to know what that feels like and have had that sensation before so if it ever does happen, there is less panic?

I don't know what will be the best way for you to deal with this situation, but maybe something to consider. Anything that "terrifies" you should be considered.

People may not verbalize it the way you did, but I suppose the diver that would not get in the water without an alternate air source is attempting to minimize that potential terror. Granted you need to have enough mental posture to go from the reg that gives zero air to the backup without the terror taking over.
Different divers rely on different alternatives: some check everything just so, some go for their buddy, other reach for their pony bottles, others to the surface (hopefully singing or humming).

Now is the time to figure out what is going to be your plan to 1- minimize the chances of taking that empty breath, and 2- a solution in case that empty breath does happen.

 

[chillyinCanada]

This post highlights the two most important lessons I've learned and top tips I share with new divers:

1) While gearing up for a dive actually WATCH the needle on the pressure guage move from 0 to full. If it's not Zero already purge to 0, then repressure while eyeballing it. (best to have an actual SPG too even if you an air integrated computer)

2) Never, ever, do a negative entry even if someone suggests you do so. So many mistakes or problems can be recovered safely if you are bouyant on the surface. If you need to get down fast that only takes a few extra seconds to dump air and go head down kicking.

There are some dives around the world where the only way you'll make the dive site from the drop spot, especially in a group, is if you do a negative entry. On those dives, I check again and again!!

 

[chillyinCanada]

Possibly my favorite advice of all time.

(it belongs in quotation marks)

Many dive guides/boat boys have been trained to check the divers' air knob just before the divers' entry. It is my practice to discourage them from touching my gear once I have checked it over. No need to be nasty about it, just emphasize that you do it yourself and that once you have, please do not touch my gear again. I always look at my spg and take a couple of fast breaths to see if needle moves before I drop into the water.

 

[davehicks]

There are some dives around the world where the only way you'll make the dive site from the drop spot, especially in a group, is if you do a negative entry. On those dives, I check again and again!!

I don't buy it. It only takes a few seconds to dump air and kick down if all is well. If it's not all well, you are missing the site for sure. Better to be safe on the surface than an accident underwater.

I've done this in the strongest currents in the world in Cocos, Galapagos, British Columbia, etc and not missed sites. BTW, I challenge you to do a negative entry in a drysuit. So it is just an uneesesary risk especially for new divers being stressed with a time sensitive group drop. Be fast but safe.

 

[chillyinCanada]

I don't buy it. It only takes a few seconds to dump air and kick down if all is well. If it's not all well, you are missing the site for sure. Better to be safe on the surface than an accident underwater.

I've done this in the strongest currents in the world in Cocos, Galapagos, British Columbia, etc and not missed sites. BTW, I challenge you to do a negative entry in a drysuit. So it is just an uneesesary risk especially for new divers being stressed with a time sensitive group drop. Be fast but safe.

Not much need for a drysuit in Maldives or Raja Ampat, Indonesia.