Navy tables

[Kaffphine]

I'm not sure where to put this, so I'll put it here.

Anyone know where I can get my hands on Navy air no-decompression tables? I've been using PADI's RDP, and after a great dive yesterday complements of Navy tables I want to find out some more. If anyone's getting nervious, I'm not jumping onto new tables right away. It's something that seems like a good idea, I want to find out if it will be for my diving. I'm gonna see him again thursday night, lots of question ready including 'Can I see those tables again?'

 

[dc4bs]

While the navy tables can give you more bottom time than PADI (etc...) tables, they do so at a price...

1) The navy tables were designed for Navy divers. What that means is they were ment to be used by relatively young, very fit divers.

2) The tables are designed with the MAXIMUM bottom time possible in mind. They are not very conservative. The idea is to let the divers stay in the water as long as possable to perform whatever task is assigned.

That being said, there are divers who claim they use them regularly and have never had a problem.

The PADI tables are basicaly a more conservative dive table version based on the navy tables and do not include any of the decompression tables that are a part of the navy tables.

Here's a thread that includes info straight from one of the developers of the PADI tables that can tell you LOTS more as well: http://www.scubaboard.com/t4109/s.html

As for where to get a copy of the navy tables?
The complete navy manual (pdf files) is available from http://www.okinawascuba.com/ in a zip file (about 9.5 Mb).

I'm sure you can find other sites to download it as well by doing a quick search with terms like "dive scuba tables navy" in most search engines as well.

 

[Ari]

You can find it here http://www.vnh.org/DivingManual/DMTOC.html

It's a big one. Enjoy.

Ari

 

[Walter]

Craig,

You are yet another victim of a common misconception. The RDP is more conservative than the US Navy tables only if you are talking about single dives. If you are discussing repetitive diving the US Navy tables are more conservative. If you use a table based on the US Navy tables that has been backed off (such as the YMCA or NAUI tables for example) then the RDP even loses that advantage.

I once took a look at various tables (surprise!) and found the RDP did not have the most conservative NDL at any depth. It ties with the unaltered US Navy tables as having the least conservative NDL at 130 ft. The tables I looked at were: US Navy, DCIEM, NAUI, YMCA, PADI's RDP and Michigan. Comparing NDL's every 10 ft from 40 ft to 130 ft I discovered no table was the most conservative (although DCIEM came close) for every depth. The unaltered US Navy tables does have the least conservative NDL's for every depth, although it does tie at 130 ft.

Most conservative NDL:

40 ft NAUI - 130 min
50 ft DCIEM & Michigan - 75 min
60 ft DCIEM, YMCA & Michigan - 50 min
70 ft DCIEM - 35 min
80 ft DCIEM - 25 min
90 ft DCIEM & YMCA - 20 min
100 ft DCIEM - 15 min
110 ft DCIEM - 12 min
120 ft DCIEM, YMCA & Michigan - 10 min
130 ft YMCA & Michigan - 5 min

Least conservative (not including the unaltered US Navy) NDL:

40 ft DCIEM - 175 min
50 ft NAUI, YMCA & RDP - 80 min
60 ft NAUI & RDP - 55 min
70 ft NAUI - 45 min
80 ft NAUI - 35 min
90 ft NAUI, RDP & Michigan - 25 min
100 ft NAUI - 22 min
110 ft RDP - 16 min
120 ft RDP - 13 min
130 ft RDP - 10 min

I should look more closely at repetitive dives sometime. It is worth noting that the DCIEM tables are modified Haldanian while all the others here are Haldanian. The format of DCIEM tables, for those of you who are not familiar with them, is vastly different (and much easier to learn) from what most of the other tables use.

 

[ScubaJorgen]

There is a nice piece of software called the Table tutor. Learns you how to table around. I think it contains Navy tables as well....
Have fun :banging:

 

[Rick Murchison]

Originally posted by Kaffphine
Anyone know where I can get my hands on Navy air no-decompression tables?

You can order tables from several places.
What you're asking for are tables 3 & 4; they can be ordered at 888-471-1055 (outside US 520-527-1055), or by mail from Best Publishing Company - P.O. Box 30100 - Flagstaff, AZ 86003-0100
Part # is B0001-34; price is $9.95 plus shipping & taxes.
They also have the complete set of Navy tables available.
Rick

 

[dc4bs]

Originally posted by Walter
Craig,

You are yet another victim of a common misconception. The RDP is more conservative than the US Navy tables only if you are talking about single dives. If you are discussing repetitive diving the US Navy tables are more conservative. If you use a table based on the US Navy tables that has been backed off (such as the YMCA or NAUI tables for example) then the RDP even loses that advantage.

Hmm... Learn sumpin new every day.

I've just gotten started doing my own comparisons on tables and dive profiles in the last month or so. I'll have to start looking at them from the repetitive angle...

I made an Excel spreadsheet dive "tool/planner". It has a gas blending calculation sheet, A PO2 calculator, MOD lookup table, 1 version of a SAC rate calculator and so far, it can plan repetitive dives using PADI, NAVY or DCIEM tables.

The PADI planner only allows no-decompression planning.

The NAVY and DCIEM planners allow decompression diving and will automaticaly fill in all deco stops from the lookup tables given an EANx for back-gas and an actual depth. EAD is calculated from those before going to the lookup tables. Total bottom time takes RNT into account if a starting RNT letter group was entered.

Each calculates PO2 % per dive (% of single PO2 exposure - not daily) and, given a SAC rate, each will estimate gas requrements for back and deco gas as well.

Am I understanding correctly that the DCIEM tables do not allow repetitive dcompression diving? Only an initial deco and then restricted to ND limits for all following dives?

I'm planning to add additional tables/planners as I can get ahold of copies of them and have the time to do it.

 

[Walter]

Craig,

That sounds like a great tool. Any chance of getting a copy?

 

[Kaffphine]

dc4bs - "As for where to get a copy of the navy tables?
The complete navy manual (pdf files) is available from http://www.okinawascuba.com/ in a zip file (about 9.5 Mb). "

Thanks, I'm downloading right now... 49%.

dc4bs- "1) The navy tables were designed for Navy divers. What that means is they were ment to be used by relatively young, very fit divers. "

I'm 20, in decent physical shape complemts of my 30lb weight belt I lugg around for 2 dive trips a week. Alas tonight will not be spent on scubaboard, I will be other places on the internet finding out about the use and creatation of navy tables.