My transition to doubles

Please register or login

Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

Benefits of registering include

  • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
  • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
  • You can make this box go away

Joining is quick and easy. Log in or Register now!

carrielsal

Contributor
Scuba Instructor
Divemaster
Messages
1,690
Reaction score
4
Location
Austin, TX
# of dives
500 - 999
I am currently taking XTR classes with Layne. I spent months researching gear configurations and trying to make half way informed buying decisions. Sunday I was to meet Layne at the lake to look at my gear and dive, so he could take a look.
I was a little nervous, so I talked my buddy Paulw to go out with me first on Saturday to try this out for the first time first. I spent countless hours researching harnesses, hog configurations, and dir configurations getting ready to transition my diving style.

I had some serious doubts how comfortable a hog harness would be for a woman. Since I do not have the ability to try before I buy, I bought a Halcyon hog rig and a DR Transplate to compare. Currently I have two Luxfer AL80’s banded together and two Apex XTX200 reg’s. I have a Halcyon 55# wing and a White’s Fusion with LE skin on order.

Saturday I went out with my dive buddy Paul Werner to Windy Point public. I took the Transplate, 1” crotch strap, and AL backplate. I had already seen inherent problems with this rig for tech diving when I looked at this rig in my living room. The clips on the shoulder harness that I thought would making adjustments easier were in the way. When I tied down my backup lights the rubber tubing covered up the clips rendering them useless. The shoulder straps were comfortable, but tying down the inflator hose was cumbersome. There are also way too many d-rings. For the first dive I used DR weight pockets. Once I started gearing up I realized that I didn’t have a buckle on the left side to hold the left weight pocket back. When I got in the water the left weight pocket kept sliding forward making the bp shift sideways. I kept trying to adjust my rig underwater and it must have been a sight, because my buddy said I looked like I was having convulsions! The Transplate also has a chest strap, and I’m still not sure how I feel about it. It looked like a good concept but in retrospect it’s just one more thing I might forget to close. I was wearing a 5mm wetsuit, 5mm hood, and gloves. I started the dive with 5# of lead. I ascended to 20’ with 2000 psi of air in my tanks and had problems staying down. I’m pretty sure I had all the air out of my wing. I had problems dumping air from the rear and had massive amounts of water in the wing.

On the second dive I had to increase my lead to 12# to go down, and I switched to a weight belt. I found that I was having to add a lot of air to the wing as I descended. My trim felt pretty good the first 10 minutes, then I felt the bp tilting. When I reached down I could feel that my crotch strap was pulling sideways but could not figure out why I could not straighten it out. Once I surfaced I found that the crotch strap had caught on my weight belt. The weight belt had shifted and taken the crotch strap with it. With all the distractions I gave up trying to find the pressure gauge. I have always hated weight belts and now I have one more reason. I also had a problem staying down again at 20’ at the end of the dive. I had breathed the tanks down to 1000 psi and was having to pick up large rocks to keep from shooting up. I’m not 100% if I had trapped air. Lucky for me, Paul is a very experienced and patient dive buddy who let me take my time to figure out my issues. It was a good day.

Saturday I learned these things. If I slide my light canister all the way to the back of my harness, I cannot reach the on/off switch. I still do not like weight belts. The Transplate is fairly comfortable, but I do not feel that it is suitable for tech diving. I’m still not sure how I feel about the chest strap. I’m just going to say no to the Transplate.

On Sunday I switched to my Halcyon SS bp and hog harness. I spent Saturday night looking at pics on the BAUE website getting everything placed correctly on the webbing. I still had reservations on how comfortable this might be. Layne had also decided that picnic tables were essential for us, so we met at Windy Point Private. I was concerned that the webbing would cut into my shoulders on the hike down the stairs. When I met with Layne Sunday morning we spent some time looking at my gear and making adjustments. I brought an additional buckle with me to secure the left weight pocket. On the right side I pushed the weight pocket all the way to the back, then put the light canister in front of it. This evened out the left and right weight pocket, and I was then able to easily reach the on/off switch. I had also switched over to a SS bp to reduce the weight I needed to carry. I put 12# of lead in my pockets. My high pressure hose is several inches too long and loops out and away from my rig. It will need to be replaced with a shorter hose this week.
When I stood up the tanks felt very secure on my back. I had no issues walking the rig down the stairs and across the rocks. I sunk like a rock when I descended and had to add massive amounts of air to my wing. I started finding the pull cord on the rear dump easier but still had problems dumping air. Layne thinks I am not putting my butt up high enough. I was able to clip and unclip my SPG several times without too much fumbling. My rig was comfortable and secure under the water. The Halcyon harness came with a 2” crotch strap which I like much better. Layne had asked me for a dive plan. I was going to dive and he was just going to follow me around. I told him that max depth would be 60’, max time 45min, and I didn’t want to go down into the trees with this rig. I was so into the rig and loving the way it felt that I blew off the dive plan. On descending I immediately went into the trees (which is my favorite place at Travis) and swam around at 65’. Several times my light cord tangled in branches, but it was pretty easy to back out. I was concentrating so much maintaining buoyancy and working on locating things like the rear dump and pressure gauge I never even noticed when Layne tried to give me an OK signal with his light. It was a much better dive than Saturday.
Layne walked out of the water and across the rocks like it was no big deal. I had to crawl out on my knees for at least 5’. Thank god for knee pads. The rig was heavy but no major problems getting back to the top of the stairs. Nothing that motrin won’t take care of.
I had my light head on my left hand, and Layne pointed out that my light cord was hanging down and gave me some ideas on how to wrap the cable around my arm to reduce entanglement. I had a ton of water in my wing which confirms I have my butt too low when trying to dump air and that instead of venting air with the rear dump I was just filling up my wing like a water balloon. I came up with 1500psi of air, so I didn’t get a chance to check my weighting with empty tanks. I need to figure out my weighing, but this will take time. I’ll stick with the weight pockets for now, but will consider a v-weight once I know what I really need.
 
Last edited:
Equipment list to date:

2 Luxfer AL80's with DR banks and manifold
2 Luxfer AL100's with Hiland banks and xscuba manifold
2 XTX200 reg's with spg
Halcyon Exploreer 55# wing
Halcyon SS BP, webbing, and 2" crotch strap
DR weight pockets and thigh pocket
Catalina AL40 with DR stage rigging and OMS workhorse reg
DR 700 lumen canister light
backup lights
various SS snap bolts, double enders, and buckles
Jetfins with spring straps
Suunto Viper
Uwater bottom timer
Suunto SK7 compass
bungie mounts
White's Fusion on order
 
Are you going to keep the viper as your SPG, and second bottom timer?

I never like my transplate harness at all. I am diving with a DIY single piece harness. I personally think the single piece harness is the most confortable setup. You will adjusting your setup for several months, I catch myself adjusting tank height, wing height, and placement of weights.
 
I will keep the Viper for a bottom timer, but if I need a computer it also will do two gas switching. I will also need to keep my recreational gear for when I DM for OW classes.
I bought the Transplate for about $60 from LP on a clearance sale, otherwise I might not have purchased 2 separate setups to try. The DR thigh pocket is alright, but I guess at some point I will put pockets on my wetsuits. At this point I think I will just get a shorter HP hose and get more dive time in before I make any new purchases that are not essential. I need to make a complete gear list for myself to include all the odds and ends. It will probably be a few months before I can truly separate out what I don't need or like versus what I will keep.
 
There is know one gear set-up that is right for everyone and particulaly m/f. I diving a hybrid type double rig and it works fine for 'me'. Without being right there to make constructive comments, I would work with Layne and his experience and take this process slow as he might suggest. Even differing dive setting will require you make some chances to your prime gear set-up. Stay calm and focused on your objective over the next 12 months, work with Layne and others you trust and you will find a solution that will meet your daily needs. :wink:
 
Ditto what Alan said. You have to do what works for you. Couple of suggestions just from what I read:

1. If your light cord is long enough turn the batter pack so the cord is pointing up and run it from the left-hand side, over your shoulders and down your arm. I do this with my Phantom and I'm 6'2". I never have had trouble with entanglement.

2. I HATE weight belts too. Instead of attaching weight to your BP (v-wieght) consider a DUI weight harness. The weight is supported by your shoulders. The harness is extremely adjustable. It's one of those things you might find used on eBay.

3. Are you sure you have a Transplate harness and not a Transpac? Either way you can get a 2" crotch strap. Make sure your crotch strap and belt are secured properly. A lot of folks think the belt goes straight across...like a normal belt. It isn't supposed to look like that though. The belt should dip down slightly in the front in a real flat "V" shape and attach to the crotch strap. That will keep it much more secure. If it is a Transpac you have and you aren't using a backplate with it then that is a mistake. I had a transpac...very comfortable, super adjustable. I ended up bolting an aluminum bp to it for tank stability. Worked great.

4. Your transplate harness should have come with 6 D-Rings. Trust me that is not too many if you're going to keep going forward in tech diving. You'll want 'em to hang deco bottles, clip off regs as you are decoing, clip off your light, maybe some line arrows, etc. You might just need to adjust their position.

Layne is a good instructor. He knows what he's doing. He can help you while you are actually in his presence at the lake.
 
I've never used the Dive Rite setup, but I can tell you that the D-rings on the Halcyon will be enough for anything you want to do in technical or cave diving.

I don't know how big a woman you are, but I have had the light cords on my can lights shortened to avoid the droop. It's a better solution than looping or otherwise fiddling with the cord to try to use up the extra. It didn't cost very much, and is apparently not a terribly difficult DIY, either.

Many, if not most people who transition to doubles find they are head-heavy, and to cope with it, they rear up to shorten the lever arm the tanks have to work with. This results in being butt-low and unable to use the rear dump without a violent bucking maneuver :) Weight belts, as nasty as they are, help with this; so does dropping the tanks as low as you can tolerate without losing the ability to reach the valves.

Another issue with venting is that you are using a big wing for double 80s. Big wings will "taco" to some degree up around the tanks, and if they aren't very full (because you have more lift than you need) the air will be a long way from the vents, either in front or behind.

As far as the amount of air you have to put in your wing -- remember, you're five pounds more negative than you have been with a single tank! You have to compensate for that extra gas you are carrying, and that means more air in the wing. And when you pick up a deco bottle, you'll have to compensate for that, too.
 
Well, Lynne beat me to it and said it much more eloquently/informatively, but I was thinking you have a wing that is too big. Now, mind you, I'm not personally doubles experienced, but the most of the divers I see and dive with use a 40# for AL80's or LP85's.

I personally love my Halcyon rig. The one and only time I noticed web bruising was when I dove with just a rash guard.

Thank you, carrielsal. Please keep us updated.
 
Sounds like you had a great 1st experience with doubles. The best advice of all those listed above is to take your time and find what works best for you. Layne is a good instructor and has good ideas. I bet you could also learn alot if you could sweet talk K-valve into a dive with you.
 
Well, Lynne beat me to it and said it much more eloquently/informatively, but I was thinking you have a wing that is too big. Now, mind you, I'm not personally doubles experienced, but the most of the divers I see and dive with use a 40# for AL80's or LP85's.

I personally love my Halcyon rig. The one and only time I noticed web bruising was when I dove with just a rash guard.

Thank you, carrielsal. Please keep us updated.

I dive a #55 with both double Al and St with no problems, but I have been doing this for years. A #40 may just make some of her issues easier to handle as a beginner doubles diver....good comment.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/perdix-ai/

Back
Top Bottom