Missing Divers - Komodo National Park

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Oh come on NW, I didn't say it was perfect! I agree about taking novice divers to the BH, and in fact I once (several years ago) talked to a girl on the boat going out there and learned that she wasn't even a certified diver - she'd done a resort course with the op that ran the boat just the day before!

But that was then. I haven't heard of anything like that since, nor have I often witnessed divers running out of air. It has happened, granted, but that says far more about the diver than about the operation. Divers have vanished in the BH, but again not for quite a few years.

The dive boat accident when it burned and sank was just that - an accident. Whether different maintenance might have prevented it is not known, but a high pressure oil line came off a transmission and sent a fine oil mist over the turbochargers. They were very hot and the oil ignited. The boat was regularly maintained by the main agents for Caterpiller, and there's not much more the operator could have done. Once the boat started burning the evacuation and rescue was exemplary.

Another boat run by another operator had a less catastrophic accident when a similar transmission oil line parted. Luckily there was no fire, but with just one engine at a critical moment the captain lost control whilst traversing the reef and ran aground. Neither the captain's nor the owner's fault. Though as this was also on an engine maintained by the Caterpiller main agent one or two questions start to come to mind. This was a virtually brand new American-built boat with new engines etc, and such an occurrence could hardly have been predicted.

A DM fell off a boat when the boat was proceeding very slowly in shallow water and he was on the bow watching for obstacles. The boat hit something and the jolt threw him off. Is that evidence of unsafe practices?

I've dived in many areas of the world and the most effectively regulated diving and boating anywhere I've seen has to be in Britain. Perhaps oppressively regulated, but very effective, and accidents are very rare despite there being a vast amount of diving. Second was the USA, where government regulation exists but is much more relaxed. I've seen someone die in America in circumstances that would have been most unlikely in Britain. But Belize is pretty good for a third-world country, with a good balance between regulation and freedom to operate. There is a tour guide system here that is unequalled in design and execution in any other country I've visited. No, it's not perfect, but it's about as good as it gets.

Just seen Don's post. The incident he may be referring to was when a large dive day boat was moored just off Long Caye, for the last dive of the BH day. The wind was strong and the seas fairly wild, and the direction of the wind was blowing the stern of the boat towards the reef only around 100 feet away. Not their choice - there are fixed moorings that they are obliged to use. All the divers were underwater and the boat empty except for the captain, who was down on the dive deck. Suddenly the mooring parted, and the captain just had time to get to the bridge and start one engine before the stern hit the coral. Nothing he could have done. The boat was stranded very high and dry for over a week and in the end was lifted off by a crane on a huge barge - they had to wait for calm conditions before they could attempt this.

It turned out the fixed mooring had parted at the seabed, probably weakened by a big liveaboard (Belize Aggressor) being tied up there only a couple of hours earlier in the same bleak conditions. It was very lucky that the liveaboard wasn't the one wrecked.
 
Seems to me you're extrapolating from your own very limited experience (you've been there once, right?) to assume that these creatures are always safe. Yet there seems to be ample evidence promulgated by experts (people whose word I rather prefer over yours) that this is not always the case. I don't condemn you for making an honest assumption based on your own experience, but please don't try to ridicule someone who I suspect is rather better read than you are, even if (like me) he hasn't been there himself. In the court of public opinion (this board) you're making a fool of yourself.

IMHO.


You really kill me.

And you have been there how many times? And I do not mean on you computer!

How do you verify that your experts are so called experts?

Why don't you do some research and find out when was the last verified death due to an attack by a Komodo dragon. And what is the rate versus number of visitors or local population. Bring some facts to the table!

Also, if that other operation is at the top of the safety pyramid in Belize then why don't you work for them since you seem to be so quick to critize other operations on the other side of the world for their safety records.

It would also be interesting to hear your justification why in Belize one of the experts on a dive boat decided to go solo diving and never came back. That's in your own backyard. How could it possibly happen with some many international standards?

In the meantime I will use my own common sense and take responsibility for my own safety, setup and verify my own gear and generally not be a tourist on the boat of experts. I will continue to dive sites that have not been trashed by the tourists and the experts that lead them. I will sample the diversity of culture that each country brings that is not American and learn what the common threads are in humanity from the people that live it. Not the news media, politicians, internet forum divers or the so called experts.

John

John
 
It didn't, and usually they don't, but every now and again you get a croc who hasn't read the rules of the game.


Oh you mean the international standards for Croc attacks?:rofl3:

John
 
Yeah Peter, I was only there once...but that one time was for 2-1/2 weeks, 9 days of that was diving. I was 1 of only 2 guests on a liveaboard that slept 16...we spent most of our non diving time exploring and hiking on different islands and checking out deserted beaches. Doing many things that a boatload of people would not have the chance to do. We encountered real live "wild" dragons on many occasions and were never bothered by them, even though they weren't those cheesy "tourist" dragons that hang out by the bustling Ranger Station!! I'm sure that's not good enough though, after all Dandy Don did read something somewhere...:shakehead:
 
How do you verify that your experts are so called experts?

Why don't you do some research and find out when was the last verified death due to an attack by a Komodo dragon. And what is the rate versus number of visitors or local population. Bring some facts to the table!John


2007 was the last time a Komodo Dragon killed someone. It was an 8 year old boy on Komodo Island. Smaller prey, like this boy, can be brought down right away. They mention the dry season & deer hunting as possible reasons, as deer seem to be the large prey item of the dragons. They bite the large prey item & wait for it to die from the bacteria in the bite.

Komodo dragon kills boy in Indonesia - Asia-Pacific - MSNBC.com

33 years before this death. Unless someone just went missing, in which case I've read that dragons eat everything, including bones & hair. Who knows? I've never been there but when I do go I will be using a telephoto lens to take pictures of them.
 
Well, this is our group on Rinca ...

066.jpg


... they really weren't paying that much attention to our presence ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
 
I read the reports of the dragons attacking deer and buffalo; I suppose the deer are smaller than typical North American deer are? Tropical and Asian deer are usually quite a bit smaller? How big are the buffalo tho?
 
you seem to be so quick to critize other operations on the other side of the world for their safety records
Simply because their conduct doesn't bear scrutiny. They're the professionals on the spot, they know the risks, they owe a duty of care to their guests, and that duty can easily and quite cheaply be met. Yet they didn't. What more is there to say?

I'm not going to bother with the rest of your post. There seems little point, as you seem convinced I'm wrong and I suspect the facts will barely confuse you.
 
Let's face it. As dangerous as Komodo dragons can be, they would be eaten alive on this forum. Vipers, cobras, pythons, dragons, sharks, wild boars, water buffalo - none are as scary as some posters here. :wink:
 

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