measurement of flash u/w

[f3nikon]

All current model Inon strobes, hard wired or optically triggered, can mimic a preflash.

Whatever conclusions you based on the assumption that Inon strobes are incapable of a preflash is flawed.



You mean to say that after you make a comment that they can't, then you will research if they can?

Called the dealer again on this...and again they said none of the Inon strobes can fire a preflash meaning OUTPUT a series of small flashes before the main flash fires. So what you diffine as "mimic" is really just the strobe firing or syncing from the preflash generated by the camera...which is an INPUT function.

Even on the Inon's write up there is no mention of any of their strobes firing a preflash. And would you think that Inon would all over my comments if any of their strobes could indeed fire (output) a preflash like the Nikon SB-800.

I believe you maybe confusing "mimic" with syncing off the camera's internal flash.

This is why Inon had to state that their strobe will work with Nikonos FILM cameras in true TTL because almost all the film cameras have no need of a preflash.

 

[bobf]

Called the dealer again on this...and again they said none of the Inon strobes can fire a preflash meaning OUTPUT a series of small flashes before the main flash fires.

I said they could fire a preflash. Inon says they can fire a preflash. S-TTL is all about the ability of firing a preflash. Advance Cancel Circuitry is all about the ability to fire a a "pregnated" preflash. The ability to fire a preflash is well documented in every link I supplied you with a few posts ago in this same thread.

Now you unilaterally change the definition of "A" preflash to mean an undisclosed "series of preflashes"?

A preflash is a preflash. A series of preflashes is a series of preflashes. To repeat. I said an Inon strobe can fire a preflash, a statement that is backed up by more than one person in this thread alone. It is also a fact well documented in independent tests done by Heinrichs Weikamp, which may be found in their web site.

So what you diffine as "mimic" is really just the strobe firing or syncing from the preflash generated by the camera...

Huh? Yes.

Even on the Inon's write up there is no mention of any of their strobes firing a preflash.

False. Directly from the InonAmerica Web site.

Automatic TTL first shot accurate exposure as simple as pressing the shutter button with digital cameras using a pre-flash. Easy operation for users wanting point-and-shoot convenience without setting camera and strobe controls. Compatible with most digital cameras having a pre-flash. Just set the camera to P Mode and "force flash", and the strobe to S-TTL and start shooting.

And:

In External Auto and Manual Modes when using pre-flash type cameras, the circuit reproduces the camera?s pre-flash, but at higher intensity for optimum underwater performance, faster internal strobe recycle time, quicker follow-up shots, and longer battery life.

I already supplied you with links to explain Inon products. I assume either you never read them or you don't understand them. Please ask questions on what you don't understand.

I believe you maybe confusing "mimic" with syncing off the camera's internal flash.

Confusing?

That is exactly what mimic means!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Internal flash on>External flash on...Internal flash quenches>External flash quenches.

 

[rjsimp]

Called the dealer again on this...and again they said none of the Inon strobes can fire a preflash meaning OUTPUT a series of small flashes before the main flash fires. So what you diffine as "mimic" is really just the strobe firing or syncing from the preflash generated by the camera...which is an INPUT function.

I'm definitely not one to believe everything a dealer tells me and Inon is not known for writing good docs, so that is not hard to believe. I can state that it does fire a pre-flash metering before the real flash in TTL mode. This is not syncing off the internal camera flash because it is hard wired with a hot shoe. Now, if I turn the strobe to manual, it will not fire that pre-flash which is the way you would expect it to work.

However the metering works, it does work and it does have a pre-flash. Not sure how I could prove it to you, but it does. Get one yourself and try it out, that's what I do. Buy and try .. if it works great! if not, oh well time to return or sell it..

 

[f3nikon]

I'm definitely not one to believe everything a dealer tells me and Inon is not known for writing good docs, so that is not hard to believe. I can state that it does fire a pre-flash metering before the real flash in TTL mode. This is not syncing off the internal camera flash because it is hard wired with a hot shoe. Now, if I turn the strobe to manual, it will not fire that pre-flash which is the way you would expect it to work.

However the metering works, it does work and it does have a pre-flash. Not sure how I could prove it to you, but it does. Get one yourself and try it out, that's what I do. Buy and try .. if it works great! if not, oh well time to return or sell it..

Fair enough Rich...Thanks for your input. In fairness to the dealer who also sells Ikelite products, he said Ikelite does not have a preflash firing strobe either, and I did buy products from this dealer before.

Addition:
Could the double pop from your Z240 be the dual flash tubes firing at different times and not a preflash? Because the Inon strobes have two small flash tubes to make up for Ikelite's DS125 larger flash tube, plus the preflash from most internal flashes I have tested, do not have a break in flash power that the human eye can notice. All we see is a longer single discharge of power and not the dual pops that you have experienced.

Again I am going by what the dealer told me because if Inon strobe does indeed fire a preflash, why would Inon not market this as their major big time advantage over the other strobe makers? Because contrary to Bob’s claim about the Inon strobe capable of OUTPUTing a preflash I have yet to see this claim on any of Inon’s marketing write up.

Maybe Inon themselves could comment on this and set the story straight.

 

[f3nikon]

I said they could fire a preflash. Inon says they can fire a preflash. S-TTL is all about the ability of firing a preflash. Advance Cancel Circuitry is all about the ability to fire a a "pregnated" preflash. The ability to fire a preflash is well documented in every link I supplied you with a few posts ago in this same thread.

Now you unilaterally change the definition of "A" preflash to mean an undisclosed "series of preflashes"?

A preflash is a preflash. A series of preflashes is a series of preflashes. To repeat. I said an Inon strobe can fire a preflash, a statement that is backed up by more than one person in this thread alone. It is also a fact well documented in independent tests done by Heinrichs Weikamp, which may be found in their web site.

False. Directly from the InonAmerica Web site.

I already supplied you with links to explain Inon products. I assume either you never read them or you don't understand them. Please ask questions on what you don't understand.
Confusing?

That is exactly what mimic means!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Internal flash on>External flash on...Internal flash quenches>External flash quenches.

Could you please post the exact statement from any of your links, that an Inon strobe is capable of firing or OUTPUTING a preflash, Thanks

 

[bobf]

Could you please post the exact statement from any of your links, that an Inon strobe is capable of firing or OUTPUTING a preflash, Thanks

If you follow this link:

http://www.inonamerica.com/content/docs/STTL_D2000.pdf

You'll see this passage found under the heading "D-2000 Pre-flash S-TTL:

"........Like the camera's electrical TTL control signal, the S-TTL of the D-2000 also sends out a pre-flash..........."

thanks for asking,
bobf

 

[Ryan]

I have seen oscilloscope graphs of a Z-240 & D-2000w outputting a preflash when connected electrically to a Heinrichs converter. Ikelite DS- strobes also preflash when connected to Ikelite's TTL conversion circuitry. It is both visible and audbile.

"let the record reflect" the dealer this guy talks to isn't me...

 

[rjsimp]

Addition:
Could the double pop from your Z240 be the dual flash tubes firing at different times and not a preflash? Because the Inon strobes have two small flash tubes to make up for Ikelite's DS125 larger flash tube, plus the preflash from most internal flashes I have tested, do not have a break in flash power that the human eye can notice. All we see is a longer single discharge of power and not the dual pops that you have experienced.

Again I am going by what the dealer told me because if Inon strobe does indeed fire a preflash, why would Inon not market this as their major big time advantage over the other strobe makers? Because contrary to Bob’s claim about the Inon strobe capable of OUTPUTing a preflash I have yet to see this claim on any of Inon’s marketing write up.

Maybe Inon themselves could comment on this and set the story straight.

No, the double pop is very distinctive and easy to hear. Plus I get the same double pop on a YS-90 which only has one flash element. So, couldn't be the difference between the two flash units inside the Z240, that would be a really odd delay and would make the strobe not even work. As Ryan said, they have tested it and it does definitely have a meter flash and a final flash.

Maybe you dealer is not understanding you or is not very well informed.. Its a very technical subject and after meeting Ryan at Reef Photo, I fully trust his ability to understand the concepts. Some others I have talked to however, well.. Lets just say they don't get it and probably never will..

 

[RonFrank]

Could you please post the exact statement from any of your links, that an Inon strobe is capable of firing or OUTPUTING a preflash, Thanks

Hmnm, does PREFLASH rock your world? See what happens when you run around making statements as fact that you are just not sure about? The Inon Rep, give me a name. VERY few dealers sell INON here, this should be easy.

Strobes fire a pre-flash... newsflash... it happens at the speed of light! Now THERE is something worth knowing!

 

[pakman]

"let the record reflect" the dealer this guy talks to isn't me...

too funny...