Management of *backmount* independent doubles?

[MichaelMc]

Also, a reason to dive doubles is redundancy for the person wearing them. A necklaced reg is REALLY easy to get to. A stowed reg on a strap not quite as easy, as it might move around more.

 

[Addicted2H2O]

@Sh0rtBus
two problems, one mitigated more easily than the other

With non reversible regulators, the left hose will cross under the diver when air sharing. This decreases the effective length of the hose, causes interference with kicking as the hose floats into the diver, and causes excessive torque in the mouth of the diver the hose is cross to. With a left handed or reversible regulator, this problem goes away, but then you are limited to about half a dozen second stages on the market *Apeks XTX series, Poseidon x3, Dive Rite XT, and Hollis 500se/Oceanic Omega*. Not a huge issue, but it is limiting. This is why I am vehemently opposed to those that dive with the long hose on the left, short hose on the right, like Dive Rite used to teach. I'm 6'4" so I use a 9' hose when diving sidemount because a 7' is barely long enough, so to shorten it that much more is to me as unacceptable as diving with a 5' hose.

Second bigger issue has 3 compounding factors and all center around the hoses crossing your body behind your neck. In the standard "Bogaerthian" setup, the left side bottle crosses behind your neck to the right side similar to backmount, and the long hose goes from right to left and back to right, also similar to backmount.
First one is the crossing allows some extra length to be put in the hoses to make turning your head more comfortable. If the hoses come straight up to your mouth, they tend to tug as you look away from that bottle which is a little annoying.
Second one is jaw fatigue is compounded by your mouth having to hold the weight of the hose and regulator, plus the torque caused during head rotation. This is especially uncomfortable in high-flow caves, high current in the ocean, and on a DPV.
Third one and arguably the most critical is that the hoses are much easier to get ripped out of your mouth when squeezing in true sidemount passages. When the hoses are crossed behind your neck, they can't pull straight down, but if they run straight up to your mouth, they can get ripped out quite easily. This is only a safety issue for those that dive true sidemount restrictions, but it's a very real concern.

Thanks for that! I appreciate the explanation. Honestly it makes a CCR that much more appealing. Maybe it's time I started selling plasma.....and organs.....

 

[tbone1004]

Thanks for that! I appreciate the explanation. Honestly it makes a CCR that much more appealing. Maybe it's time I started selling plasma.....and organs.....

CCR long hose donation is not without its own issues. There's another thread that I started last week on primary donate that has a lot of focus on sidemount and CCR long hose management.

 

[Addicted2H2O]

CCR long hose donation is not without its own issues. There's another thread that I started last week on primary donate that has a lot of focus on sidemount and CCR long hose management.

I did actually read some of that thread. For me....first things first....gotta get into tech. My LDS just recently converted over toe SDI/TDI so we'll have a tech program now. And I don't think there are too many shops in the metroplex that actually have one. So hopefully it'll attract some "new" divers. I was actually talking to the instructor Saturday while my OW class was going over the online test questions about doing the Adv. Nitrox and Deco as one class rather than two separate ones. I'm still financially recovering from the MSD/DM class and would like to get a few more dives in before I go down the rabbit hole. I think Solo might be in my future, too. Not so I can dive alone, but so I can learn to be more proficient and self-reliant when diving with my 10 yr old son once he starts diving with me. But I digress, as I don't want to take away from the original topic.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

IMHO, yes. Maybe I’m unlucky, but I’ve never seen a side mount diver on a wreck that looked like they were having an easier time than backmount. Not on the boat and not in the water. Unless and until I see otherwise at least a few times, I’ll leave it alone.

You should dive in BC. There's a huge sidemount community there that dive prolifically, a few who are in this video:

 

[rjack321]

You should dive in BC. There's a huge sidemount community there that dive prolifically, a few who are in this video:

yes and they pretty much all do exclusively shallow 32% critter dives and the vast majority of those are from shore.

no trimix, no deco, no scooters which is fine, but it's disingenuous to say that sidemount is fabulous for everything, especially for charters/boat dives.

 

[wedivebc]

I used independent doubles for many years. I usually had a buddy in similar config so long hose was not an issue since no single failure could render you without sufficient gas to exit safely. I can't be much help with the insta-buddy scenario but I did have a right-hand, left-hand reg setup that I kept on bungy necklaces.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

yes and they pretty much all do exclusively shallow 32% critter dives and the vast majority of those are from shore.

no trimix, no deco, no scooters which is fine, but it's disingenuous to say that sidemount is fabulous for everything, especially for charters/boat dives.

Oh geez. Here we go again. The point is that these folks are quite proficient and it does get choppy out there. I will agree that there is a skills issue very often. The only issue I see which Tom pointed out is whether the entrance/exit is too narrow to walk through with cylinders on both sides. Jumping into the water is no big deal. Climbing a ladder is no big deal either.

 

[MichaelMc]

Definitely. Trimix, a stage, some deco and a scooter is better jumping off the boat in backmount.

Now that we have that as an ok situation, why is it not ok to jump off and climb back on sidemount with 2x AL72, 2x LP85, or 2x LP50?

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Definitely. Trimix, a stage, some deco and a scooter is better jumping off the boat in backmount.

Now that we have that as an ok situation, why is it not ok to jump off and climb back on sidemount with 2x AL72 or 2x LP85?

I don’t see an issue of trimix and two deco gasses. I’ve done it off a boat in the Strait of Juan de Fuca when diving the Diamond Knot (well, I wasn’t diving trimix but I did have EAN50 as my deco gas).

If we are going to talk about what most people do, they exclusively dive without scooters.

People need to look outside their own worlds. People dive in a variety of configurations successfully,