Looking for a Vintage mask?

[navychop]

I still use my Pinnochio. It is easy to clean out sand, just remove 2 screws. I thought about writing the company, and complaining that the skirt is compressing, but I guess I got my 40 years worth out of it. Pretty soon, I'm gonna hafta get a new one.

 

[David Wilson]

David I have looked for Escualo Sports and found a page but it seems to be down. are they out of business? 123 scuba.com does offer what I'm looking for but I do like the look of the light blue mask from oceanways but all I get from their web site is a pic and price nothing more as far as a way to order.
Hope I'm not being to much of a bother, but I do appreciate the help.

No bother, Avonthediver. I'm always delighted to help anybody interested in classic masks or fins because that's the kind of equipment I most enjoy researching and using.

I'm a little confused about your message, though. From what you've written I deduce that 123 scuba.com at

Classic Oval Rubber Mask: Scuba Gear and Diving Equipment

offers an option that you'd be happy with, the "classic rubber oval mask" that costs $19.99 sales price. All you have to do is click the "add to basket" button and then the checkout button and you're all set for payment.

You then mention the Oceanways option, which I take to mean the "Classic Pacific Mask" at $36.95 from Discount Divers at

Discount Divers - Oceanways Classic Pacific Mask

In this case, you simply click the "Choose style below" button, selecting either the black rubber or silicone option. There isn't a blue Oceanways option, I'm afraid, just a choice of black and clear.

Finally, there's the Escualo Ixtapa mask, which I mentioned in passing as my current favourite. The masks section of the Escualo Sports website, which is in Spanish, but there are plenty of pictures if you don't know the language, is at
Visores
Escualo of Mexico manufactures four masks in all with blue rubber skirts:
Ixtapa (Mask with equaliser allowing nose to be pinched)

Chico (Plain mask without equaliser, presumably for children because "Chico" means "child")

Adulto (Plain mask without equaliser, presumably for adults)

Cancun (Mask with equaliser allowing nose to be pinched)

As well as Excualo Clasica full-foot rubber fins, which I love, I own Ixtapa and Cancun blue rubber skirted masks, both of which I find comfortable to wear and watertight unless their straps are buckled too loosely or tightly. I've never been to Mexico, nor do I have any plans to visit the country, so I first tried to obtain my Escualo fins and masks by emailing the company in Mexico City, writing to them in pidgin Spanish, as my knowledge of foreign languages is limited to French and German. I received a response, but it was clear from the company's message that they were only interested in large wholesale orders, not in satisfying the requests of individuals. I eventually tracked down a Mexican company, however, which was prepared to take my order and export my fins and masks from Mexico to the UK. The company was Badesports, whose slogan "Todos los Deportes + Todas las Marcas" means "all sports plus all brands" and whose website is at
Badesports México - Todos los Deportes + Todas las Marcas
and my contact person there was Jonas, whose email address consists of his name, followed by "@" then "badesportsDOTcomDOTmx". No spaces, replace "DOT" with "." He reads and writes English perfectly and I paid for the transactions via Moneygram. I could also have paid via Western Union. He doesn't accept PayPal. Be prepared to be contacted by your national customs agency, or the shipping company acting on its behalf, and to pay some kind of import tax, I was obliged to do so by UK customs and excise, but the amount payable wasn't too large and the delay wasn't too long. Jonas was scrupulous, keeping me informed of the arrival of my payment and the progress of my order. He gave me a shipping company tracking number and I was able to follow the package's progress online.

Hope I've answered all your questions. If not, do get back to me.

 

[David Wilson]

I tried ordering a Pinocchio mask from Amazon.co.uk and it doesn't look like they will ship to the US. :depressed:

I have seen other sources from Europe in the past, but it would be convenient if someone in the US would sell it. Maybe I need to find one of the bigger shops that sell to the US regularly... shipping always seems expensive from Europe.

You're right, Luis. Denney's, the UK diving retailer collaborating with Amazon.co.uk, won't sell to any country other than the UK and the Irish Republic. Subprof.com of Spain, however, also stocks the Pinocchio mask and is prepared to dispatch orders to any country in the world:
CRESSI PINOCCHIO MASK
So does Diveinn of Spain:
Cressi Pinocchio. Masks Masks, Scubastore.com, buy, offers, scuba

You're right too about intercontinental shipping costs. I've ordered diving gear from retailers in the United States and sometimes paid more for shipping to Europe than I've paid for the goods themselves, so it works both ways. Occasionally everything comes down to how much you need something rather than how much of a bargain something happens to be. It's very likely that a Cressi Pinocchio, which goes for a mere 14 euros (about $20) on this side of the Atlantic, will cost at least as much if not considerably more in shipping charges to the United States.

You're right again about exploring another avenue, the readiness of a US Cressi dealer to "special-order" a Pinocchio mask. Cressi USA's website is at
Cressi Professional Scuba Diving Equipment - fin, mask, snorkel, regulator, BC

As I see it, the problem with classic dive gear lies with its distribution, not with its manufacture. Scubapro, for example, sold its open-heel Jet Fins everywhere in the world, but the same company chose to sell its excellent floating all-rubber full-foot fins only in the USA and never in Europe. For the life of me, I cannot fathom why Scubapro would come up with such a discriminatory marketing policy.

David

 

[Couv]

You're right, Luis. ....
You're right too about ....
You're right again about ...
David

Luis is always right. :cool2:

c

 

[Nemrod]

Dan at www.vintagescubasupply often keeps some decent true oval Asian sourced masks in stock. They are not quite like the good old ovals we used to love but work just fine. Aqua Lung still makes the Atlantis and Pacifica which are not ovals but are certainly vintage eligible and are favorites of myself and Slonda and they come in silicone.

True ovals are just darn rare, I borrowed from a vintage buddy, a USD Equa Rama (sp) and it is wonderful and vintage and was a last of the line and made in silicone but they have not been available in years and years.

My favorite mask of all time is unfortunately, the Atomic Frameless, sorry vintage dudes, function before form, especially when the form is rotten rubber with 40 years of ozone decay.

N

 

[David Wilson]

Yes, I agree that the world of ancient and modern vintage masks is full of compromises, particularly if the plan is to dive the mask, not just display it.

The elusive top screw
What seems almost impossible to obtain nowadays is a twenty-first-century-manufactured vintage-style mask with a metal rim that can be tightened at the top with a metal screw. Only Chinese companies appear to make such masks nowadays, e.g. the curiously named "Weihai Sunshine Fishing Tackle Company", whose range extends to no less than six different models, one of them coloured green:

Diving

The curvature
Vintage-style masks came, and still come, in all sorts of curved shapes, even circular:

Masks
However, we probably consider "classic oval" to be the iconic shape of a vintage-style mask. Be aware, though, that an oval, or ovoid, unlike an ellipse, is an ill-defined shape, so you're going to find a range of mask morphology around, some with flatter tops and bottoms, others approaching circularity.

The skirt material
Most pre-1975 diving masks had natural rubber skirts. Before the mid-1970s a few, quite expensive, masks came with silicone skirts to serve the hypoallergenic market. Later, more and more masks were manufactured with silicone skirts, as much in response to a change in fashion - clear silicone masks were deemed more "photogenic", especially after they were popularised by pretty female Hollywood stars in scuba-based films - as their use by a growing number of people with skin allergies.

Unlike natural rubber, silicone is a synthetic material and I expect Nemrod is right in suggesting that silicone has greater inbuilt longevity than natural rubber. I too mentioned that the rubber of many historical mask skirts will be too hard and perished for the mask to be anything other than a display item. However, everything comes down to compromise, as I said at the beginning. I prefer fresh milk to processed "long-life" milk because it tastes better to me. I have vinyl window sills in my home, but I'd really prefer wooden ones because they look warmer. I choose to wear a more expensive woollen suit instead of a cheaper polyester suit because the former looks better. As you can see from my above preferences, I like natural materials more than I do man-made, synthetic ones. Natural materials have built-in mortality, they are going to decay and fall apart at some stage, like ourselves . When they are fresh and new, natural materials are "live" materials, with a certain familiar feel, taste and smell. Whenever I entered a dive store more than four decades ago, I knew within seconds from the prevailing odour whether the stock of masks and fins was brand new this month. For me, and this may be highly subjective, silicone, vinyl and other man-made materials are sterile, lifeless substances which may last for ever but pay a price by being without a familiar smell, taste or feel. Marcel Proust wrote a long and celebrated novel which began with a few childhood memories aroused when as an adult he dipped a madeleine cake in his tea and tasted it. The dunking of the cake was a regular childhood treat and tasting it again as an adult recaptured the author's lost youth. Somehow I doubt that some man-made concoction such Cool-aid would have had the same effect. That's why I will always prefer natural-rubber skirted masks to synthetic-silicone ones, although, as a lifelong pluralist, I will also fight to the death for everybody else's right to choose silicone-skirted masks instead.

 

[D_B]

Thanks David, interesting and informative posts

 

[Avonthediver]

Thanks David I now know were I went wrong looking! and thanks once again.

 

[captain]

Yes, I agree that the world of ancient and modern vintage masks is full of compromises, particularly if the plan is to dive the mask, not just display it.

The elusive top screw
What seems almost impossible to obtain nowadays is a twenty-first-century-manufactured vintage-style mask with a metal rim that can be tightened at the top with a metal screw. Only Chinese companies appear to make such masks nowadays, e.g. the curiously named "Weihai Sunshine Fishing Tackle Company", whose range extends to no less than six different models, one of them coloured green:
View attachment 62612
Diving

The curvature
Vintage-style masks came, and still come, in all sorts of curved shapes, even circular:
View attachment 62613
Masks
However, we probably consider "classic oval" to be the iconic shape of a vintage-style mask. Be aware, though, that an oval, or ovoid, unlike an ellipse, is an ill-defined shape, so you're going to find a range of mask morphology around, some with flatter tops and bottoms, others approaching circularity.

The skirt material
Most pre-1975 diving masks had natural rubber skirts. Before the mid-1970s a few, quite expensive, masks came with silicone skirts to serve the hypoallergenic market. Later, more and more masks were manufactured with silicone skirts, as much in response to a change in fashion - clear silicone masks were deemed more "photogenic", especially after they were popularised by pretty female Hollywood stars in scuba-based films - as their use by a growing number of people with skin allergies.

Unlike natural rubber, silicone is a synthetic material and I expect Nemrod is right in suggesting that silicone has greater inbuilt longevity than natural rubber. I too mentioned that the rubber of many historical mask skirts will be too hard and perished for the mask to be anything other than a display item. However, everything comes down to compromise, as I said at the beginning. I prefer fresh milk to processed "long-life" milk because it tastes better to me. I have vinyl window sills in my home, but I'd really prefer wooden ones because they look warmer. I choose to wear a more expensive woollen suit instead of a cheaper polyester suit because the former looks better. As you can see from my above preferences, I like natural materials more than I do man-made, synthetic ones. Natural materials have built-in mortality, they are going to decay and fall apart at some stage, like ourselves . When they are fresh and new, natural materials are "live" materials, with a certain familiar feel, taste and smell. Whenever I entered a dive store more than four decades ago, I knew within seconds from the prevailing odour whether the stock of masks and fins was brand new this month. For me, and this may be highly subjective, silicone, vinyl and other man-made materials are sterile, lifeless substances which may last for ever but pay a price by being without a familiar smell, taste or feel. Marcel Proust wrote a long and celebrated novel which began with a few childhood memories aroused when as an adult he dipped a madeleine cake in his tea and tasted it. The dunking of the cake was a regular childhood treat and tasting it again as an adult recaptured the author's lost youth. Somehow I doubt that some man-made concoction such Cool-aid would have had the same effect. That's why I will always prefer natural-rubber skirted masks to synthetic-silicone ones, although, as a lifelong pluralist, I will also fight to the death for everybody else's right to choose silicone-skirted masks instead.

I can still recall the smell of my first real mask, a Squale. Prior to that all I had was a kiddie mask with a plastic face plate bought at the beach souvenir store.

 

[micklock]

http://cgi.ebay.com/VINTAGE-HEALTHW...286.m7QQ_trkparmsZalgo=LVI&itu=UCI&otn=3&ps=5