Lake Travis fatality - Texas

[RayfromTX]

As is often the case we will never know exactly what happened in this case and yet can still get insight from this unfortunate accident. One possibility based on what we have been told is that he tied himself to a line before descending. If that line was tied in a way that was not able to be reached while diving then that is something we should obviously avoid.

If there was no cutting tool available to free an entanglement then that is certainly something we can avoid. I take two cutting devices on every dive. I see no reason to change that even if I'm in a pool. I put my hands on them on every dive. My hands should know how to instinctively find them while my attention is focused on other matters.

If the line that he was said to be tethered to was in fact a submerged line he had no knowledge of beforehand and it was simply tangled on a suicide clip or regulator then that is also something we can work to avoid while again always having cutting tools available.

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[loosenit2]

Likely a reference to the below quote being possibly related to not having a cutting tool to deal with the situation:

“...a preliminary review shows that the line he had been tethered to had been significantly tangled.”

If that is what it was it was an interesting way to jump to conclusions while being snarky. I would think that a more tactful and respectful tone could be struck, someone lost their life and we don't know all the circumstances.

 

[Compressor]

Very sad story. To die where you are so close to the surface is even more horrifying to me.

Cutting device on every dive. No matter how shallow. Perhaps 2 as @RayfromTX mentions.

 

[Dan]

If that is what it was it was an interesting way to jump to conclusions while being snarky. I would think that a more tactful and respectful tone could be struck, someone lost their life and we don't know all the circumstances.

First of all deepest condolences to the deceased family & friends. I’m sorry for not mentioning earlier. I have lost a brother in an accident so, I do know the sadness feeling of a loss of close family.

At what point did I jump to conclusions & being snarky? When I read about such sad situation “...a preliminary review shows that the line he had been tethered to had been significantly tangled.”, it reminded me of my own situation, losing cutting knife and would like to share my lesson. I thought this accidents & incidents thread is about what you would learn from them, not the passing & condolence thread.

I apologize if my remembering on my incident & wanting to share my solution to the situation is being misunderstood as “jump to conclusions & being snarky”.

 

[lv2dive]

I didn’t take it as disrespectful or snarky. Part of the point of A&I is to discuss how to prevent similar situations from occurring in the future, which I believe was the point being made.

If that is what it was it was an interesting way to jump to conclusions while being snarky. I would think that a more tactful and respectful tone could be struck, someone lost their life and we don't know all the circumstances.

 

[Joneill]

If that is what it was it was an interesting way to jump to conclusions while being snarky. I would think that a more tactful and respectful tone could be struck, someone lost their life and we don't know all the circumstances.

Sorry - I don't see anything at all "snarky" or "jumping to conclusions" in his response? To me, he was was just relating his thoughts on the importance of cutting tools given the mention of entanglement in the AP article.

 

[loosenit2]

First of all deepest condolences to the deceased family & friends. I’m sorry for not mentioning earlier. I have lost a brother in an accident so, I do know the sadness feeling of a loss of close family.

At what point did I jump to conclusions & being snarky? When I read bout such sad situation “...a preliminary review shows that the line he had been tethered to had been significantly tangled.”, it reminded me of my own situation, losing cutting knife and would like to share my lesson. I thought this accident & insider thread is about what you would learn from them, not the passing & condolence thread.

I apologize if my remembering on my incident & wanting to share my solution to the situation is being misunderstood as “jump to conclusions & being snarky”.

So here are the conversations I heard in my head as I read the post that led me to conclude what I did.

Someone loses a friend or family member in a dive accident and you are discussing it with them. After they relay some details about getting tangled your response is, I lost my knife once, a friend found it so I keep it lashed to my BCD now. If I was the family member or person relaying the loss I would probably abruptly end the conversation and leave.

The 2nd conversation I imagined was in an accident review board. After someone relays the intial sketch of what occurs one of the board members offers that they always strap a knife to their BCD because they lost it once. That is more polite but not very relevant, as the fact that he did not have a knife, or even the circumstances of the drowning have not been fully laid out. To comment about a knife is to make a lot of assumptions about what happened, it presumes you know the cause of the accident and how to avoid it based on your personal experience.

Understand from your posts that was not what you meant, and it appears from the supporting posts that many others did not interpret it that way. I most certainly don’t want this conversation to take over this thread, just want to explain my comments and what led me to conclude what I did.

 

[Addicted2H2O]

Do we even know whether the diver had a knife/cutting tool on him during the dive? Maybe he did. Just because a diver carries a cutting tool on their person during a dive, we can't assume:
A. He/she knows how to free themselves
B. That the diver in this incident didn't become so entangled that he completely panicked to the point of irrationality
C. That maybe he ran out of air while trying to free himself wit a cutting tool

It was never mentioned in the articles whether or not he was carrying a knife or shears on him so we really can't say without additional information. But I can say from experience I've seen a diver go from relatively calm to completely overwhelmed with panic to the point they couldn't even begin to comprehend the most basic skills and lain in the mud on the bottom of the dive location. If it weren't completely terrifying I'd almost be amazed at how much influence panic has on the human mind.

I realize this doesn't really "help" in this discussion and I certainly offer my deepest condolences to the diver's friends and family and am saddened that the dive community has lost a member, especially here in our home state. My only reason for this post is to convey the seriousness of what can happen in a pure panic situation and remind us all how important it is to remain calm during our dives.

 

[RayfromTX]

Just to clarify why the posts here are written the way they are I will post a copy of the special rules of the A&I forum. Please note that there is a separate forum for condolences. This forum is for the respectful and important benefit of divers that may learn from the unfortunate loss of life that accompanies our sport. Theories of the causes are relevant because it is actually somewhat rare to get the whole story of what happened but we can still learn even if we get it wrong.

Special Rules for the Accidents & Incidents Forum

The purpose of this forum is the promotion of safe diving through the examination and discussion of accidents and incidents; to find lessons we can apply to our own diving.
Accidents, and incidents that could easily have become accidents, can often be used to illustrate actions that lead to injury or death, and their discussion is essential to building lessons learned from which improved safety can flow. To foster the free exchange of information valuable to this process, the "manners" in this forum are much more tightly controlled than elsewhere on the board. In addition to the TOS:

New Rules:

• Someone has died or been injured. Please show the proper dignity, etiquette and refrain from any demeaning remarks. We discourage the family from reading these threads, but you can bet they still will. Let's be civil, sensitive and still remain relevant. This forum is only intended for learning and not assigning blame.
• This is a strict 'No Troll' and 'No Chest Thumping' zone. It's not the place to keep repeating your favorite topic no matter how important or relevant you may imagine it to be. Nor is it the place to tell us how this wouldn't have happened if they dove/taught the way you do.
• You may not use real names here, until after they have appeared in the public domain (articles, news reports, sheriff's report etc.) Please cite the source if you do.
• Discussions should only be about the causes, theories and remedies for these accidents. Off topic posts or those with off topic comments may be removed without notice. Condolences, including comments indicating surprise and indignation, should be kept to the Passings Forum, legal action should be kept to the Scuba Related Court Cases Forum and so forth.
• If you are presenting information from a source other than your own eyes and ears, please cite the source. Links are preferred.
• Those who can not seem to follow these rules will have their access to this forum quickly revoked. As always, you should use the report button rather than bicker about possible infractions in the thread.

 

[Addicted2H2O]

I honestly hope more light gets shed on this story. I think it would do the diving community some good to see what can go wrong during dives and how these issues can be prevented. I can't stress enough how important it is to remain calm and not panic. The guy I pulled from the bottom of the lake was necessarily in any imminent danger, but had I not been bubble watching he could've been down there a while and as much of a panic state as he was in I don't have the full confidence that he would've taken it upon himself to figure out how to get to the surface. And he was breathing down that AL80 pretty damn quick! So if you take nothing else away from this thread and these posts, remember to keep calm. As long as you have a reg in your mouth and air in your tank, chances are pretty good you can solve any other issue under water and keep an incident from becoming an accident.