is this class worth it...Advanced Buoyancy Clinic (ABC)?

[mathauck0814]

I know I can't hold STILL for ten minutes. I can stay in the same place, same depth, and same trim, but even Georgitsis moves a fin now and then . . .

Well yes, that's the goal. You get my point.

 

[RickyF]

I just spent two weeks in Cozumel. I asked one of the instructors to watch me and give me feedback on getting my gear optimally trimed out. After the dive, he gave me some really good feedback and helped me to move a little weight around and the difference was amazing. You really have no idea what you look like when diving unless you are really way off or someone is either watching for you or you have a video of your dive. I asked this particular instructor because I noticed that he was really nicely trimmed out and smooth and relazed during the dives. It will also help your air comsumption as you will dive much more relazed.

 

[Rich Keller]

I was thinking of taking it but I fgured for $100 I could read a book and practice the skills myself. I much rather take other courses towards my master card. I do not plan on taking every course out there as it is not that cheap. I probably could buy books online for much cheaper and self study alot of this stuff but wouldnt get the card for it. What does the forum say?

is there a book online that i can dowload to help with Advanced Buoyancy? Any experiences out there?

This course sounds like underwater basket weaving to me. I think you could do much better talking to people here and then working out your own issues in the water.

 

[RJP]

This course sounds like underwater basket weaving to me. I think you could do much better talking to people here and then working out your own issues in the water.

I didn't see enough information about the course to draw such a conclusion. In fact there was NO information about the course anywhere in this thread. Wondering how you came to this conclusion.

 

[ScubaSteve]

Turned into the typical pretty quickly this time. I am surprised nobody has invoked "you know who" yet.

As has been said, this course canNOT be taught from a book. Good buoyancy and trim takes time to achieve and that time frame is different for every diver. As has been suggested, the course may be good but it may also not. Talk to the instructor. Ask what they offer as part of the course. As Dive-aholic mentioned, if a video is not included, consider passing. There is no better way to realize your weaknesses than to have them pointed out on you yourself (i.e. video of you). The video also allows you to see what you are doing well and where you have improved. If the Instructor is not prepared to talk about weight distribution as it relates to trim, then I would pass. Your target should be to be able to walk away "on the road to" being able to hold you place in the water column with little to no movement.

I would definitely stay away from self "book taught" buoyancy and would suggest that talking to the instructor is a good idea.

 

[halocline]

In general, my feeling is that buoyancy classes are among the most useful classes for new divers, but obviously it's impossible to evaluate a course without knowing more about it. The PADI peak performance buoyancy, even with it's flaws, is usually very beneficial to divers just coming out of OW training. The quality of the teacher has a big impact on the course quality.

Worst case, it's doubtful that this course would have zero benefit to you, and almost impossible that it would be detrimental. Whether it's worth $100 is pretty subjective...

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I was thinking of taking it but I fgured for $100 I could read a book and practice the skills myself. I much rather take other courses towards my master card. I do not plan on taking every course out there as it is not that cheap. I probably could buy books online for much cheaper and self study alot of this stuff but wouldnt get the card for it. What does the forum say?

is there a book online that i can dowload to help with Advanced Buoyancy? Any experiences out there?

Sounds like a good deal to me if the instructor knows what they're doing ... but it depends on what's more important to you, good skills or another card.

For comparison purposes, I charge $200 for a four-dive clinic that focuses primarily (but not entirely) on buoyancy control ... and my students generally tell me it's money very well spent.

You cannot learn buoyancy control by reading a book ... you have to train your body what it feels like, and that means getting in the water with someone who knows what to look for and can provide you real-time feedback.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

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See if it includes video feedback. If not, then find another instructor.

As Dive-aholic mentioned, if a video is not included, consider passing.

That's one of those generalities that I disagree with. I don't use video, and am pretty successful at training my divers. We do our dives pretty shallow (generally around 20 fsw), and come up when I want to talk about something. The benefits are that real-time feedback gives you the ability to make adjustments during the dive, rather than on the next one ... and doing several controlled ascents ... with stops every few feet ... is a very effective tool in teaching buoyancy control.

How do you suppose people learned it before a few years ago when underwater video suddenly became affordable?

Some things a buoyancy class should focus on ...

- Ascents/descents ... you should be learning to do the former without touching the bottom or stirring up silt, and doing the latter with the ability to stop whenever and for however long you want to.
- Trim and weighting ... you should learn how to weight yourself properly, and distribute your weights so that your center of gravity allows you to hover in pretty much any position you want to
- Hovering ... you should be able to hold a stop for a minimum of a minute or so without movement, except as needed to compensate for water motion.
- Breathing control ... buoyancy control and breathing control are inextricably linked ... you cannot achieve the former without having mastered the latter. Think of your lungs as a "fine tune" BCD.
- CoB/CoG drills ... you should be learning how body position affects your trim, and how trim affects your buoyancy
- Task-loading ... you should be able to control your position in the water while concentrating on doing something else or fixing a problem

Things an instructor should be looking for ...

- What are your feet doing when you descend
- What are your hands doing when you swim or hover
- What does your body do when you stop all motion and go completely relaxed
- What happens to your breathing when you are task-loaded

All of these things have an effect on your ability to control your position in the water, and are the symptoms of instinctive responses that work well on land, but not so well underwater ... and therefore must be retrained. These are things you will not be able to detect in yourself, and someone not trained to look for will not pick up on ... which is why self-taught buoyancy control is, at best, learning the hard way and at worst an exercise in futility.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[DivemasterDennis]

The value of any diving course is dependent upon the competence and professionalism of the instructor, of course. But consider this: The best golfers in the world from time to time go to a coach to work on a skill they think needs work, or to explore alternative ways to approach a particular shot, and practice it under the knowledgeable eye of the coach. Professional dancers, from classical ballet to modern, regularly "take a class" to have their skills evaluated and improved. Other professionals do the same. So should you take the class?
DivemasterDennis

 

[ScubaSteve]

That's one of those generalities that I disagree with. I don't use video, and am pretty successful at training my divers. We do our dives pretty shallow (generally around 20 fsw), and come up when I want to talk about something. The added benefit is that doing several controlled ascents ... with stops every few feet ... is also a very effective approach to teaching buoyancy control.

How do you suppose people learned it before a few years ago when underwater video suddenly became affordable?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

I will never say that someone cannot learn without video. I do however think that it will be easier to understand the problem if you (the student) can actually see it for yourself. There is nothing wrong with using video in your scenario and the student can see themselves after making the changes you discussed (or not making the changes they thought they were).

Bottom line is, I think that almost everybody can be taught and learn buoyancy through instruction and diving, but I think that considering video as a tool, it can still add value to the process. I know I would love to see more video of me in the water to see how my trim and buayancy are. I feel like they are good and I am told they are......but sometimes seeing is believing.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Video is a useful tool ... like most tools, if it is used properly. As an instructor, I would only consider it if I had someone else doing the video ... I want to devote my full attention to the student, not the camera. That's why I said the comment was a generality ... video can be useful, or it can be a distraction, depending on how it's used. It should not, however, be used as a criteria for determining the value of the class.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)