Insights from Rescue for BP/W users

[vbcoachchris]

You'll be cutting the harness once you reach shore or the boat. Very shortly after, your unresponsive diver is probably going to be cut out of their drysuit too. So if you nick it, that's the least of their problems.

Not to mention the knife worn on her waist is so sharp it will cut the webbing with very little effort. It is ludicrous to think it would make the problem worse.

 

[rjack321]

BP/W, jacket, weightbelt, suit, etc. you shouldn't hesitate to cut anything that gets in the way of getting them out of the water to shore based EMS or on the boat going towards aid. Just don't rush and cut their arm off.

Gear is cheap and if they don't survive - their heirs aren't going to be happy that you saved the gear at the expense of the victim.

 

[Makin Raider]

Amen, lol, teknitroxdiver, Amen

I went through all this in my rescue and DM class . BP/W are here to stay. Even Sport Chalet here in SoCal will have to adjust because they will be carrying the Apeks BP/W, which I will be recommeding over much of what they sell.

 

[Green_Manelishi]

My husband and I are currently in the middle of our PADI Rescue class. Last night's pool session was largely devoted to scenarios where one would want to get the diver out of his or her gear. What became very clear was that neither any of my fellow class members (except my husband) nor the instructors was familiar with a BP/W Hog harness setup. Nobody knew the best way to get somebody out of a harness. When I played "unresponsive diver", the fellow who came to help my husband "rescue" me had a hard time discerning which buckle was my weight belt and which was my harness.

The instructors asked me what I thought the best way to get someone out of a harness in a hurry was, and I said, "Cut it." They said, "With what?" I said, "I carry shears in my drysuit pocket." And they said, "But somebody rescuing you is not going to know that . . . " And there's a point there. My husband knows, but if I get separated from him and somebody has to save me who doesn't know me, they won't know. I've been told that any serrated dive knife will go through harness pretty easily, but not everybody carries them, either.

Anyway, I guess what I took away from this was that the vast majority of the divers out there will not be familiar with a hog rig, and if you are diving on a boat or something where you have a new buddy, it might be worth a minute or two to talk about weight systems, crotch straps, and cutting implements before you get in the water.

This is exactly why I dive solo, with other's similarly equipped or close friends who know the gear I am wearing and how it differs from their gear. Friends don't let friends dive with strangers

 

[rmannix]

My husband and I are currently in the middle of our PADI Rescue class. Last night's pool session was largely devoted to scenarios where one would want to get the diver out of his or her gear. What became very clear was that neither any of my fellow class members (except my husband) nor the instructors was familiar with a BP/W Hog harness setup. Nobody knew the best way to get somebody out of a harness. When I played "unresponsive diver", the fellow who came to help my husband "rescue" me had a hard time discerning which buckle was my weight belt and which was my harness.

The instructors asked me what I thought the best way to get someone out of a harness in a hurry was, and I said, "Cut it." They said, "With what?" I said, "I carry shears in my drysuit pocket." And they said, "But somebody rescuing you is not going to know that . . . " And there's a point there. My husband knows, but if I get separated from him and somebody has to save me who doesn't know me, they won't know. I've been told that any serrated dive knife will go through harness pretty easily, but not everybody carries them, either.

Anyway, I guess what I took away from this was that the vast majority of the divers out there will not be familiar with a hog rig, and if you are diving on a boat or something where you have a new buddy, it might be worth a minute or two to talk about weight systems, crotch straps, and cutting implements before you get in the water.

What I always taught my students was for a weight belt, rig it as "right hand release"
Sweeping with the right hand opens the buckle. The BC or harness should be rigged the opposite direction, sweeping with the left hand will open the buckle.
No need to waste time cutting anything.
During a surface rescue I wouldn't hesitate to open both.

 

[Don Burke]

BP/W are here to stay. Even Sport Chalet here in SoCal will have to adjust because they will be carrying the Apeks BP/W, which I will be recommeding over much of what they sell.

I wish I had some copies of dive magazines from the days when the jacket BC was introduced.

The horsecollar fans were probably saying pretty much the same things.

 

[spectrum]

TSandM

Like it or not despite the legion of BP/W divers in this forum it is far from the standard configuration of recreational divers. Hence the onus is said diver to brief his buddy on what to do. Just as the buddy should know that s/he is expected to take your primary in the event or an air share need.

Some of the things you cite extend to jackets as well. Not all jackets have velcro cummerbunds and fastex clips on the waist strap, some use the same style buckle so you haven't cornered the market on that confusion.

As for the difficulty clearing the shoulder straps that comes with the territory and falls back to the pre-dive briefing.

In the instance where you choose to dive solo or become separated from your buddy but an uniformed diver happens upon you in distress all you can do is hope that they catch on or that you can communicate. That's the downside of running a minority configuration.

IMO the bigger risk is having a diver at your side capable of performing the rescue than getting you out of the harness.

Pete

 

[TSandM]

Pete, you're right . . . one of the things that has become clear from taking this class is that gear comes in a myriad of configurations, with different clips/releases/buckles/straps/weight systems, and it can be very confusing to try to decipher somebody's equipment under pressure. It just struck me that not even the instructors in this class knew anything about the gear I was using, as opposed to the gear everybody else had, and this, to me, augured poorly that anyone coming across me in the water would recognize how best to manage my stuff. There are some things that are QUITE different from "normal" gear, like the lack of releases and the presence of a crotch strap, and these things are not expected by the non BP diver.

Most of the people I dive with use the same kind of gear I do, except my husband, and that's one of the reasons I used this gear in this class, was so that he would get the benefit of some instruction on how to handle it. Turns out that benefit was pretty small.

I'm taking the PADI Rescue course because GUE doesn't offer a Rescue course, and I thought the course material was important to know. So far, I think the class is a very good one, and was well worth my time.

 

[countryboy]

....When I played "unresponsive diver", the fellow who came to help my husband "rescue" me had a hard time discerning which buckle was my weight belt and which was my harness.....

In a rescue scenario, you would want to release the weightbelt and the harness, get rid of the weights first, then get rid of the BC (BP or jacket)...

If you remove the BC and leave the weights... makes for a negative buoyancy scenario..

My thoughts... why not unbuckle both?? Keep the diver floating on the BC . The weight belt will pull through the buckle pretty much by it's self.. although you probably don't want them falling in the pool during practice.

Thoughts?

 

[proyce]

I just tried out the new Apeks BP/W this past weekend. I will never dive a jacket-style BC again. Once I got used to it, it was so much better than the jacket style. Now I just have to figure out whether I want to get the regular harness that comes with it, go with Hog webbing. I'm going to do the bungee thing with my octo reg, now that I figured out how to do it (thanks to a couple of threads on this board). When I dive with other divers, I will have to make sure they know how my stuff works, but the regular harness is easy to get off and on - easier than a jacket BC. The Hog rig I haven't tried yet.