Hog D1 Vs. Dive Rite Xt Vs. Other?

[Bigeclipse]

For self servicing, you are not limited to DR or Hog. They just officially suppoort it. You can still service regs like atomic or sp, parts are easy enough to get.

You have time, you can buy used. Could it be hog, DR another legend. I just don't think it is necessary to spend $700 on a set of double reg.

I love my legend but honestly I see myself having a long career in diving and I do see myself going technical which means several reg sets for doubles and stage bottles and buying expensive legends for that purpose just does not work for me. I just bought the double tanks and I currently have one 40cu stage. Eventually I will simply want to service all my own gear and it just seems Hog is the way to go for me right now. Cost, ease of obtaining parts kits and there is available maintenance class specifically for hogs. I am a visual learner (yes I can read books but it is just easier for me to see things) so having a hands on training or even videos would be best for me. I wouldn't be spending $700. I would be spending 250$ on one Hog set to use with my Legend LX this summer and then purchase the second Hog set over winter allowing me to have a set for doubles and a set for singles or at least that is my plan. That will also give me 2 years before I really need a regulator maintenance class, unless something goes wrong with the Hogs and they need service before then. If that is the case, I would simply send them off to get fixed.

 

[tbone1004]

DR sells the parts, but won't publish the manuals or provide training. They don't support or encourage it, but they don't act like Scubapro, Aqualung, or AUP and make it impossible to get official kits without going to gray market. Hog is currently the only manufacturer that offers training to the public. I think the Dive Rites are a better regulator, but it is splitting hairs. Keep in mind that the D1, while not officially discontinued, is essentially discontinued, and may not be available for the price that they are currently at. If you call the big dealers, Cave Adventurers, Dive Right in Scuba, etc. they can work with you much more on buying multiple sets at the same time because they are no longer under the MAP requirements from the manufacturer which is why Edd was able to offer a Hollis SMS75 with Dive Rite XT full sidemount set for like $1100 at Black Friday, or how they can offer the XT regulator package for $735 which includes inflator hoses, a reg bag, and a pair of ball swivels when the XT Nomad package from Dive Rite is $800 without inflator hoses. Same reason Dive Gear Express always marks their reg packages as "custom" packages, the XT Advanced OW package is $600, but theirs is the same price and comes with a yoke adapter and inflator hose for the same price.

 

[Bigeclipse]

DR sells the parts, but won't publish the manuals or provide training. They don't support or encourage it, but they don't act like Scubapro, Aqualung, or AUP and make it impossible to get official kits without going to gray market. Hog is currently the only manufacturer that offers training to the public. I think the Dive Rites are a better regulator, but it is splitting hairs. Keep in mind that the D1, while not officially discontinued, is essentially discontinued, and may not be available for the price that they are currently at. If you call the big dealers, Cave Adventurers, Dive Right in Scuba, etc. they can work with you much more on buying multiple sets at the same time because they are no longer under the MAP requirements from the manufacturer which is why Edd was able to offer a Hollis SMS75 with Dive Rite XT full sidemount set for like $1100 at Black Friday, or how they can offer the XT regulator package for $735 which includes inflator hoses, a reg bag, and a pair of ball swivels when the XT Nomad package from Dive Rite is $800 without inflator hoses. Same reason Dive Gear Express always marks their reg packages as "custom" packages, the XT Advanced OW package is $600, but theirs is the same price and comes with a yoke adapter and inflator hose for the same price.

hmm I didn't know the D1s are being discontinued. Does that mean parts kits will be hard to get too? I see that DRIS still has the D1s in stock for pretty dang cheap. $550 for doubles setup (includes spg and hoses) or $250 first and second stage with hoses (no SPG)

 

[Jim Lapenta]

The D1's are not discontinued nor are they being discontinued. There is no plan to do so. They are the best seller and have been proven. They are a very popular reg and IMO have some benefits over the D3 in terms of cost and servicing due to less things to screw up.

The big change to the D1 is that from now on only the sealed version will be sold. It's the most popular and offers benefits to divers and service techs. In fact all the HOG regs - D1, D2, and D3 will only be sold in the sealed versions.

Don't listen to people who only think they know what they are talking about.

I am in regular contact with Jack at HOG and we were just discussing the class to service regs last week. I'm also an instructor for the class, just taught another one this past Saturday, and one of the people involved with making some changes to it. Changes that the dive community is going to like.

If you want to talk D1's and getting certified to service your own email me at the link in my signature line.

 

[tbone1004]

Did you read what I actually wrote? nothing in there was about Jack discontinuing them, it was that they may not be available for $250 for a pair in a year. Of course they're the best sellers, Jack priced himself out of the market with the D3's, sure they're nice regs, but not worth $450/set. It goes against what that brand started for by pricing them that high, especially with the ridiculous cost of the parts kits. The d3 regs are not value regs, and there truly is no reason to purchase them over the Dive Rite's or any other regs anymore. The d1's were brilliant when they came out because they were so cheap, and at $250 they still are, but right now I have the option to pay less than $100 more for the Dive Rite's for a sidemount regulator package, and that is truly worth the premium.

"Keep in mind that the D1, while not officially discontinued, is essentially discontinued, and may not be available for the price that they are currently at."

The Deep6 regs are on the water finally, and those blow both of them out of the water, and will have freely available kits, and will have a class in the near future. The major problem with the Hogs and the Deep6 regs will be availability of parts if you're travelling, and finding people that will service them until you service yourself. You will always have much better access to parts with Dive Rite than you will with either of them, so you either have to commit to carrying parts kits and tools with you at all times if you are comfortable servicing them, or mailing them off to someone like Jim to have them serviced.

 

[eelnoraa]

....
The Deep6 regs are on the water finally, and those blow both of them out of the water, .....

Did I miss something? Blow Hog out of water is a tough order.

 

[tbone1004]

cost for quality for features for performance, they will be much better. They're very nice regs, dove one of the final prototypes last week in cave country, they're very very nice regulators. The d3's are truly noticeable in difference from the D1's, and the XT's are comparable to the D3's imho. The D6 regs are going to be one of the best performing regs on the market.

 

[runsongas]

another option is to pick up a used legend if you see one for sale. there was one posted recently on the local craigslist for 200 which could probably get bargained down to 160.

 

[Doby45]

I go back to the cost difference. If I could take a D1 and put it on one tank and an XT and put it on another tank (back mount doubles), identical secondary regs and someone basically do a "blind taste test" with swapping the regs up so you did not know which you were breathing off of, there is no way you would know at 100' if you just pulled air from the D1 or the XT. I personally could not care one way or the other which reg set you eventually choose, but the whole reg A is a bazillion times better is getting old. I was drawn to the Hog series of regs and other items, because they were cheap to get into the sport with (did not need to drop $800 on a Scubapro first and second reg) they are/were highly regarded by the "technical" crowd and they did not surround the servicing of the regs in black magic voodoo. All those items were refreshing to me and will continue to be.

 

[tbone1004]

you can tell with the second stages, the first stages have some nice features that are worth noting. I.e. the D3 is super nice because the din screw is offset which allows the whole turret to rotate 360* which the Apeks DST clones can't do and until the D3 limited you to the piston first stages. The reason the D1's were adopted with such energy was because of how cheap they used to be. When they first came out you could get a full doubles set for under $500 with SPG, vs. much more than that for the Dive Rite or Hollis equivalents, and unlike Hollis, parts kits were available. Then the class with TDI came out which was huge, but the prices then started creeping up, and with the D3 it was now priced identically to the Hollis and Dive Rite offers, and it removes tons of momentum for the brand. Conveniently at the time it was also better than both the Hollis and Dive Rite options, but then the XT came out from Dive Rite and leveled the playing field. The XT is now significantly cheaper than the D3, so I have no idea why anyone would purchase the D3. The D1 is still around, but the XT is essentially the same price in a doubles/sidemount kit, and has a better second stage as well as better dealer support.