Here we go.....
- Thread starter uwsince79
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Iguana Don
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It is far better to let this or any other thread run its own course and stop through "natural selection" than to try as stop it artificially, unless it gets out of hand and starts to violate the rules of this Board. Lots of people have thoughts and would like to express them. There is one that has not been mentioned and as I have been watching this thread from the "git go", nobody has mentioned, more on that later.
If for some reason you don't like a particular thread or it makes you uncomfortable, may I suggest that you dont read it, but please dont try to stop it. Not all threads will be to everybodys liking or interest, not all threads will have humor in them. Some threads will even get heated as anybody who believes in their ideas and facts will have a passion for expressing them. Lets just try to remain civil about it. The moderators having been doing an execellent job of doing just this.
This is a very controversial topic and needs to be discussed to its fullest, and to run its own course. We in the diving community are the ones that will ultimately make the decision.
Which brings me to the topic that nobody mentioned, and that is the possibility of government regulation. The SCUBA industry is a self regulating entity, that is the government keeps its nose out of our business as long as we keep our business safe. If it starts to get unsafe and out of hand then guess what? In steps Big Brother and we are all up that well know tributary without any mode of locomotion. So certification from any agency is better than none at all. It would be best to get certified and then if you feel that your son got the short end of the stick then if you think you are better at teaching him than the instructor was, then go for it.
Bobb, your logic escapes me. You said youve bought 2 complete sets of gear, will teach him and see if he likes it then get certified. Seems to me it would have been a lot less expensive to get him certified 1st and see if he likes it and then purchase the gear if needed.
You said, hooka diving is just like SCUBA except you dont have the tanks. Sorry Bobb, but you are way off base on this one. On hooka there is a limit to the amount of danger you can get into.(limited by the length of the hose) On SCUBA there is NO LIMIT TO THE AMOUNT OF DANGER YOU CAN GET INTO.
You said approx. 30 dives. One more time, off base again, there is no way that you can have perfected your skills enough to qualify you to instruct someone else. IMHO you are playing Russian Roulette with 5 loaded chambers and one empty.
ID
If for some reason you don't like a particular thread or it makes you uncomfortable, may I suggest that you dont read it, but please dont try to stop it. Not all threads will be to everybodys liking or interest, not all threads will have humor in them. Some threads will even get heated as anybody who believes in their ideas and facts will have a passion for expressing them. Lets just try to remain civil about it. The moderators having been doing an execellent job of doing just this.
This is a very controversial topic and needs to be discussed to its fullest, and to run its own course. We in the diving community are the ones that will ultimately make the decision.
Which brings me to the topic that nobody mentioned, and that is the possibility of government regulation. The SCUBA industry is a self regulating entity, that is the government keeps its nose out of our business as long as we keep our business safe. If it starts to get unsafe and out of hand then guess what? In steps Big Brother and we are all up that well know tributary without any mode of locomotion. So certification from any agency is better than none at all. It would be best to get certified and then if you feel that your son got the short end of the stick then if you think you are better at teaching him than the instructor was, then go for it.
Bobb, your logic escapes me. You said youve bought 2 complete sets of gear, will teach him and see if he likes it then get certified. Seems to me it would have been a lot less expensive to get him certified 1st and see if he likes it and then purchase the gear if needed.
You said, hooka diving is just like SCUBA except you dont have the tanks. Sorry Bobb, but you are way off base on this one. On hooka there is a limit to the amount of danger you can get into.(limited by the length of the hose) On SCUBA there is NO LIMIT TO THE AMOUNT OF DANGER YOU CAN GET INTO.
You said approx. 30 dives. One more time, off base again, there is no way that you can have perfected your skills enough to qualify you to instruct someone else. IMHO you are playing Russian Roulette with 5 loaded chambers and one empty.
ID
A group of us just had this discussion, with a group of New Instructors, and the hot topic of SRO's (self regulated organizations) that we know as the dive industry. I think it is very apparent that the government has no business in this field, which it has no understanding. Case in point the recent ban on shark feeding in South Fla. Bought to a closing vote with some wonderful help from the press (Here I am being very sarcastic.)
I fell this topic (SRO's not shark feedings) alone would make a great thread. Many new to diving do not know that the industry is self regulated and hopefully will stay that way, which is why I am a little adamant on some changes or just plain awareness to keep government out and FUN in.
Yours till the viz clears,
I fell this topic (SRO's not shark feedings) alone would make a great thread. Many new to diving do not know that the industry is self regulated and hopefully will stay that way, which is why I am a little adamant on some changes or just plain awareness to keep government out and FUN in.
Yours till the viz clears,
Just noticed this thread...
hm.
First of all- I think everything is streitned with me and Uwsince79, in the original thread. He thought I was rediculing one of the things he said there, while it wasn't so (but did seem so, becouse I used the 300 dives term he first implied). Actualy, on the point with the 300 dives, I totaly agree with him (well, maibe 200 should be enough) and so with most of the other points he made. I was upset though, by something a guy named "spydertek" wrote and I am still waiting for his answer.
Iguana-Don-
About regulation- read the my thread "recreational diving law". I think it did only good to the divers and diving industry of israel.
About uncertified divers-most of the uncertified divers in Israel are spear-fishers. There are about two or three cases of seriouse accidents happening to those guys here every year, usualy ending with death. Considering the fact that there are maibe 5000 divers of this sort here, probobly a lot less, it is quite a lot, not to mention the less seriouse accidents. In all of these accidents, off course, the divers have to pay the bills out of their own pockets, as they have no insurance (it is usualy in thousands of dollars).
Another point-Uwsince79- How many accidents were there back in the days when people dived without agencys?
-A lot.
And one last thing-
Throwing some mud on eachother isn't neseserily bad...
There's a saying, that goes something like: "After wrestling for some time with a pig in the mud, you come to see that he quite enjoys it".
It was toled to me by my all time dive guru, when he found out I kept drowing him to foolish arguments, only to make him mad.
hm.
First of all- I think everything is streitned with me and Uwsince79, in the original thread. He thought I was rediculing one of the things he said there, while it wasn't so (but did seem so, becouse I used the 300 dives term he first implied). Actualy, on the point with the 300 dives, I totaly agree with him (well, maibe 200 should be enough) and so with most of the other points he made. I was upset though, by something a guy named "spydertek" wrote and I am still waiting for his answer.
Iguana-Don-
About regulation- read the my thread "recreational diving law". I think it did only good to the divers and diving industry of israel.
About uncertified divers-most of the uncertified divers in Israel are spear-fishers. There are about two or three cases of seriouse accidents happening to those guys here every year, usualy ending with death. Considering the fact that there are maibe 5000 divers of this sort here, probobly a lot less, it is quite a lot, not to mention the less seriouse accidents. In all of these accidents, off course, the divers have to pay the bills out of their own pockets, as they have no insurance (it is usualy in thousands of dollars).
Another point-Uwsince79- How many accidents were there back in the days when people dived without agencys?
-A lot.
And one last thing-
Throwing some mud on eachother isn't neseserily bad...
There's a saying, that goes something like: "After wrestling for some time with a pig in the mud, you come to see that he quite enjoys it".
It was toled to me by my all time dive guru, when he found out I kept drowing him to foolish arguments, only to make him mad.
Bobb
Guest
Iguana Don
First off, I'm surprised to find this thread still going...but under a different
thread. You stated that it would be cheaper to get my son certified than it was to buy
additional equipment....(This way I always have back ups) and....the prices I paid, and
where the equipment was purchased from would start a whole different controversy.
You also stated that Hookah diving was safer (in so many words) because of the
depth you can go to, being limited to the length of your hose....Hoses come in 100'
lengths also...So, are we to assume that at 100' on hookah that you are safe? even
though my hoses were only 40' x 2 hoses. Are you also stating that at 40' it is
completely safe? Because if you are, then maybe my instructors missed something in
telling me about the barotrauma , Lung bursting, etc. that can happen in as little as
10' of water....
Also, I am not saying that I am a great or good teacher, just that I CARE more
about my sons health and safety than any instructor on earth!!! And it's not for
insurance liability reasons either...with saying all of this, I again want to thank
everyone for their valuable input.
First off, I'm surprised to find this thread still going...but under a different
thread. You stated that it would be cheaper to get my son certified than it was to buy
additional equipment....(This way I always have back ups) and....the prices I paid, and
where the equipment was purchased from would start a whole different controversy.
You also stated that Hookah diving was safer (in so many words) because of the
depth you can go to, being limited to the length of your hose....Hoses come in 100'
lengths also...So, are we to assume that at 100' on hookah that you are safe? even
though my hoses were only 40' x 2 hoses. Are you also stating that at 40' it is
completely safe? Because if you are, then maybe my instructors missed something in
telling me about the barotrauma , Lung bursting, etc. that can happen in as little as
10' of water....
Also, I am not saying that I am a great or good teacher, just that I CARE more
about my sons health and safety than any instructor on earth!!! And it's not for
insurance liability reasons either...with saying all of this, I again want to thank
everyone for their valuable input.
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