Halloween ScubaBoard Get Together- Hunt or not to Hunt

[Wildcard]

Don't be a perv LOL, dusk is the best time anyways WC...don't suppose you have a boat? =)

I have boats all over. My Hawaii boat is on the big Isle thou. Can't seem to find a place to park it here

 

[justleesa]

Did you try Keehi Lagoon? you could also park it for up 120 days at the Ala Wai Harbor (near the hilton)

 

[Cacia]

" But, shooting fish in a barrel with scuba at a popular local dive site is a different thing."


Thank you, that kinda sums it up. I am really not anti-hunting. I was making several points. 1) Hunting methods command varying degrees of respect. 2) I do not believe Course Directors and Instructors spear on the YO257 but if they do I would like them to come forward and make their case and see how others react to them and their businesses 3) Maybe MM, knowing how some of us feel should just spear someplace else out of respect for others.

Otherwise, I tend to respect people that are willing to debate and especially if they have the ----s to spell acquiesce in this forum without spellcheck. (Is there spellcheck somewhere?)

 

[Wildcard]

Did you try Keehi Lagoon? you could also park it for up 120 days at the Ala Wai Harbor (near the hilton)

I need trailer boat parking. Tried everywhere public. No room at the inn!

 

[Cacia]

Anybody wants a serious laugh should wander over to the Underwater photography thread where there are some pretty funny posts on these moral dillemmas. Unless you want to help MM pray for sex with wildcard and plan where to park the boat trailer. Does pray for sex mean hunt lobster? I mean I am just guessing...

 

[MilitantMedic]

Pray for Sex=Yokohama bay

 

[MilitantMedic]

...But, spearfishermen would do themselves a great service by emphasising the sporting side of what they're doing, and ridding themselves of their image as underwater vandals who wreck things for everyone else.

But, shooting fish in a barrel with scuba at a popular local dive site is a different thing.

First for those who didn't clearly understand the context in which the "...shooting fish in a barrel.." comes from, spearing fish on a wreck IS NOT shooting fish in a barrel. I said that even shooting fish in a barrel is MORE SPORTING THAN buying fish at the supermarket. Which it is. Now as far as the presumed ease of spearing on a wreck...it is no more difficult than anywhere else.

As far as using scuba for spearfishing...it is MORE difficult, therefore more "sporting" to do it with scuba and a polespear or even a speargun. I say this becuase fish as a general rule are far more afraid of a big clunky noisy apparatus that makes bubbles than a sleek silent freediver.

As far as focusing on the "sporting aspect" of spearfishing...I don't spearfish for sport...I don't kill anything I won't eat. I hunt to eat. While you, I presume, go and buy your fish from the supermarket. This is an example of the Ostrich Effect, you don't see them killing fish therefore it is more acceptable.

Still trying to figure out why some one would spear a tiggerfish...you can't really eat it.

 

[MilitantMedic]

" But, shooting fish in a barrel with scuba at a popular local dive site is a different thing."


Thank you, that kinda sums it up. I am really not anti-hunting. I was making several points. 1) Hunting methods command varying degrees of respect. 2) I do not believe Course Directors and Instructors spear on the YO257 but if they do I would like them to come forward and make their case and see how others react to them and their businesses 3) Maybe MM, knowing how some of us feel should just spear someplace else out of respect for others.

Otherwise, I tend to respect people that are willing to debate and especially if they have the ----s to spell acquiesce in this forum without spellcheck. (Is there spellcheck somewhere?)

1) Covered that in the above post, I'll rehash if you like.
2) Still can't get them to come online, only email and PADI's website. But feel free to flog me instead. =)
3) I think this comes down to if I respect everyone's wishing I wouldn't be spearing at all. In the same vein I don't spear is present company ask me not to. Hence I ask before I spear. I also don't spear in front of customers for pretty much the same reason.

Testicular Fortitude better word choice? LOL No spellcheck but they need to add one!

 

[Wildcard]

Anybody wants a serious laugh should wander over to the Underwater photography thread where there are some pretty funny posts on these moral dillemmas. Unless you want to help MM pray for sex with wildcard and plan where to park the boat trailer. Does pray for sex mean hunt lobster? I mean I am just guessing...

Just don't drop your weights at the surface while waiting for the boat.

 

[redrover]

Why not debate? It's a good natured debate, everyone is entitled to their opinions, let's hear yours.

I read this from the begin and resisted airing my opinion, I’ve been asked before if I’m one of those tree hugging owl lovers with derision and counseled by friends that my zeal for preservation may be a bit in the zealot range. I admit it; the scope and variety of our planet is immensely fascinating to me, I enjoy seeing, experiencing nature naturally. I’m well aware my opinions are not shared by many but after reflection I am compelled to speak up.

I have been extraordinarily lucky to have done so in places where man has not altered the way it is, and I have seen where man has altered the balance of things. While I’m all for denying sport hunting and allowing or reserving it for subsistence (man is a natural predator) I am loathe to create additional rules and regulations let alone burden taxpayers. Is our society not already over regulated with laws we cannot afford to enforce?

It is beyond my grasp to understand why man cannot or will not learn from history; realize the mistakes we’ve made and refuse to compound the errors or allow them to continue. I say man because it is mankind who has clearly the power to make the greater changes to our environment. From his signature line, MilitiantMedic may agree.

On occasion nature does rise up and show her true domination, she sticks to one area in general and we call these acts of god and natural disasters. We cry out in pain for the loss of our improvements, the reclamation of flood plains, we see it as a loss when our artificial beauty is not able to withstand the power of nature and mourn the inevitable shifts in balance.

I do accept that progress and improvement have value; my communication method here, inconceivable at the time of my birth is just one example. I also accept, my choice of environment or where and how I live, is not for everyone. I’m certain there are people with equal disinterest in seeing what’s underwater as I am to be surrounded by concrete and steel.

Can we not share this planet, must we continue to abuse what little is still relatively unchanged by man? Do those who wish to experience it not have equal rights?

It saddens me greatly that a fellow human would be amused by another creature desperately willing to live as it is drug along slowly loosing it’s life force for the remainder of a dive. That we are proud to work hard to amass…was it 90 lobsters in one hunt? I cannot see that was not a severe depletion and alteration of balance for the area. When such things happen to man it is termed inhumane by those not participating.

I live where the particular ocean geography providing convenient access inspired the industry of big game sport fishing, the African Lion Safari of my parents’ generation. I found this with a google search for world record marlin, note the date was over 23 years ago:

Species:Marlin, Pacific blue Lbs-Oz:1376-0 Where Caught:Kaaiwi Point, Kona, HI Date:May 31, 1982

And the “legendary tales of hour-long fights, reel-spooling runs, and an angry marlin majestically soaring above the water to shake off a lure" fish size is declining. From the same site http://www.kuuloakai.com/ pictures, the operators promotion enticing enthusiasts, show Aug 20, 2002 a 835# Marlin. Then 18 monts later March 30, 2003, a 669# Marlin. http://javascript<b></b>:openWinEx(...ike Corell, Wendy Stevens, and Capt Rusty.');It is now over two years after the most recent photo, if they were getting bigger fish wouldn’t they proudly display the photos?

I realize MilitantMedic is not talking about marlin fishing at all but I think the decrease in Marlin caught size is a demonstration of reduction in size of available Marlin and this can be applied to sport fishing in general. We are depleting our oceans just as we have depleted many of our natural resources for sport and commercial justifications. If we haven yet managed to wipe out something should we try to? By the time they are gone so will we, will it not matter?

When MilitantMedic politely offered to debate my reaction was; what’s there to debate? Hunters feel well within their rights and non-hunters feel deprived of pleasure, who will change their views? All persons so far responding can see the points or sides of each. MilitantMedic says he eats his fish, he hunts for food. I assume he is hunting within legal limits and so agree he has the right to do so.

With the understanding an artificial habitat (resting, secure places) attract fish (among other things) to thrive, procreate, preditate and sucomb, what many recreational divers are looking to see - observe them alive and swimming - more than once and for the following generations of divers as well.

What I am interpreting catherine96821 is asking, is that would he please not hunt where persons seeking non-hunting recreation are likely to be. She has offered to ask other hunters to avoid such places as well. If he (they) are hunting for food vs observing natural marine life interaction, is it not reasonable to ask they do so elsewhere and let areas remain in a more natural state for those who wish that type of pleasure. Are less predatory humans not justified in having those places, pursuing their choice of recreation which hunting alters?

http://www.bigmarinefish.com/extinction.html​

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