H2O Odyssey Spare Air

[grilla]

my question to grilla would again be that we need more input, why do you need one, what would you use it for? When would it ever come in handy? The answers to all of these questions are generally reflective of irresponsible gas management or other irresponsible mistake that divers were warned about the first day of their OW class.

And even if I had used one, I would never tell anyone. (really, i haven't)

Hello again. I scrolled way back to check my original post to check the wording. I wanted to make sure that I really said what I meant to say. I did. Since you said you've never used one, I keep wondering why you replied at all. I wasn't looking for opinions or philosophy, just first-hand experiences. I also wasn't looking for an argument or a fight. Neither do I walk away from one. I'd like to think that your reply was meant to be well-intentioned and enlightening. But that's hard to believe when your wording was condescending and, for lack of a better word, snotty. Just my opinion.

I got a kick out of your reply today. Do you ever listen to the Bob and Tom Show? It's nationally syndicated morning radio. They also have a web-site. They do a segment called "Mr Obvious". You might enjoy it.

I just erased a long-winded reply I typed about risk management and acceptance, parallels in other sports, safety philosophy and the like. Then I realized I've been doing what I just criticized you for - offering unsolicited advice. Maybe we've both learned something

Have a nice life

 

[matt_unique]

my question to grilla would again be that we need more input, why do you need one, what would you use it for? When would it ever come in handy? The answers to all of these questions are generally reflective of irresponsible gas management or other irresponsible mistake that divers were warned about the first day of their OW class.

And even if I had used one, I would never tell anyone. (really, i haven't)

The above is the type of post you need to weed out from your SB experience. Divers who say a 'redundant breathing system is for people who don't know how to manage gas' has no idea what they are talking about. If a diver uses this system as a means to extend bottom time they also have no idea what they are doing.

Back to the point of the thread....I have no experience with a Spare Air. When I began diving I evaluated redundant breathing systems including Spare Air and decided a pony bottle with a standard reg was the better choice for me. Your decision to get a back-up breathing system is 'right on the money' for the obvious reasons you already know. Most people, from my experience, look down on the Spare Air primarily because of the low volume of air offered. Most people who subscribe to pony bottle use have 19CF or more. I used a 13CF for shallow shore dives and a 30CF for boat dives. Anything less than that REALLY limits your time or ability to resolve problems, safety stop, etc. For all I know, Spare Air makes a great integrated regulator system. I preferred to go with a well known/proven regulator mounted on a pony bottle as I mentioned above.

Good luck with your research.

--Matt

 

[grilla]

Hi Matt
THANK YOU! I considered a 19 cu ft but thought a 13 would be adequate for my needs. I may upgrade later but figured this was a good place to start. Thanks again

Don

 

[matt_unique]

Hi Matt
THANK YOU! I considered a 19 cu ft but thought a 13 would be adequate for my needs. I may upgrade later but figured this was a good place to start. Thanks again

Don

A 13CF may be adequate for your needs, you'll need to determine that based on your depths and air usage. If you are doing 40' shore dives, 13CF will be plenty in my opinion to safely get you back to the surface on a direct ascent to safety stop then surface. If you are diving to 100' this will not likely be adequate.

As I mentioned I don't have any experience with the Spare Air systems. If you acquired a pony bottle and "regular" regulator you would have lot's more options. You could throw the same reg on a larger pony bottle as your needs/depths changed for example. You could turn around and use a 13CF pony bottle as an Argon supply if you ever needed it, etc. You would not have any of these options with a Spare Air system. A Spare Air also takes one of your hands "out of service" since you need to hold the bottle to your mouth to breath. Especially if you had a 13CF Spare Air. That would be pretty heavy to try to hold in your mouth with no hands. These are a few other reasons why I would suggest a pony bottle as opposed to a Spare Air.

--Matt

 

[O2BBubbleFree]

There has been a little ongoing confusion in this thread, and I thought some clarification might be in order.

We seem to be confusing two different systems.

Submersible Systems http://www.spareair.com/product/models.htm makes the Spare Air, which consists of the tank and an integrated valve/first stage/second stage. The most popular model is 3.0 cu ft at 3000 psi, but they also have a 1.7 cu ft version, and a 3.0 cu ft Nitrox version.

H2Odyssey http://www.h2odyssey.com/ makes a couple of different systems. One, the Extra Air Source, consists of a 6.0 cu ft, 3000 psi tank, integrated valve/first stage, and a short-coupled second stage (basically no hose, just a couple of swivels).

H2Odyssey also offers Redundant Air Systems (RAS1, RAS2) which consist of the same integrated valve/first stage and a normal-length-hosed second stage. This system will fit any size pony bottle.

Since grilla stated that he has ordered a 13 cu ft version, I assume that it is an H2Odyssey RAS system with a 13 cu ft tank. grilla, is that correct?

I think in keeping with the mindset of this board, grilla's system qualifies as a pony, not a Spare Air.

FWIW, I’m not promoting either product. Just trying to clear up some confusion.

 

[grilla]

Matt thanks for the additional info and 3dent you are absolutely right about the need for clarification. I began talking about mini-bail out bottles and used the term "spare air" as a generic classification for hoseless 3 and 6 cu ft bottles. That was a mistake. The day I started the thread I was looking for info on the H2O Odyssey 6 cu ft model. Over the course of my research I decided I needed at least 13 cu ft and a hosed-reg vs a fixed one. As for the RAS1/RAS2 issue - the short answer is I don't know. The integrated 1st/2nd stage and reg from the 6 cu ft Odyssey that I have been looking at has multiple ports. One can be fitted with a hose for the reg, I plan to use another for a minipressure gauge. My impression is that the assembly will come as seen on the web page 3dent posted above and in the dive shop we will add the hose - allowing me to wear the bottle in front and not have to try to hold the entire assembly up in front of my mouth. Thanks Gents

 

[RLarsen]

I'm interested in this subject of backup air provided by the H2Odyssey product. As a new diver I often wonder why bailout bottles are not more widely used by recreational divers for an additional measure of safety. I am also puzzled why small backup bottles are always discussed in terms of providing enough air to get to the surface with a safety stop. What about providing extra time to reach a buddy and safely begin sharing air before ascending. I'm told being suddenly and totally cut off from your air is very rare. I recently heard a story from an instructor about a guy who had his 1st stage suddenly stop functioning. The diver was swimming Devil's Throat in Cozumel about 120' down. He had to swim about 40' feet to share air from the DM. When I think of OOA situations I tend to think more about getting the buddy's attention and swimming to him more than going right to the surface. Sure, I understand being close to your buddy is the desired plan and is part of training. But if you are not close for any reason you need time and a clear head to get your buddy's ( or DM's ) attention to get to that air source. When drift diving in Cozumel there were moments when buddies weren't really close to each other. There were also times when kicking against current was work to get back to the buddy or group that stopped to look at something. I can't help but think having a little extra air within reach to give you an extra minute or two would be desireable and smart. Also I'm curious how you would deal with a bailout bottle if you were traveling by air and using dive ops like you find in Coz.
Rex

 

[matt_unique]

....Also I'm curious how you would deal with a bailout bottle if you were traveling by air and using dive ops like you find in Coz.
Rex

I always bring a pony when I travel. For easy tropical diving I bring my 13CF pony and bracket for an alum 80 primary tank. You have to discharge all the air of course and remove the valve in case security needs to inspect it. You would also need to pack the tank in your luggage. Since 911 I have not been able to bring it as a carry on (understandably) because they consider it a possible bludgeon weapon. Extremely important the tank is discharged with valve removed from the tank altogether. Once you're at your destination get her filled and you have your redundant air supply.

--Mat

 

[grilla]

Hi
Just got back from an Air National Guard deployment. I had to order the equipment and it came in while I was gone. HAven't seen it yet. Get back in touch with me in a couple of days and I'll let you know what I think.

Thanks

Don

 

[jaycanwk]

Dude.. this is not a situation where you have to have had to come close to a near death experience to comment. Look up "rock bottom" then get out your calculator and plan a dive to 100ft and tell me if your little Spare Air will get you out of an OOA situation safely.