Force Fins and DIR diving

[Luganodiver]

Well, this is my first post, one has to start somewhere, right?

I am a 54 YO diver with 35 years of diving experience. I have recently taken (and Passed!) a GUE Fundie course, where I have learned all propulsion techniques.

No mayor issues there, but I find the Jetfin to be very hard on my foot. I was a happy user of Seawing Novas and then Gorillas prior to buying the Jetfins for the Fundie course. These fins allowed me to flutter my way upstream in strong currents. I can still do it with the jetfins at the cost of murdering my feet and ankles. I have an European 45 size, and I wear a DUI drysuit ( what else?) with turbo soles.

i regard myself as rather powerful swimmer.

now to the questions:

1) is there a Forcefin that would allow me to frog kick, but also to do helicopter turns and backward kick?
2) is the extra force fin still produced? I like its specs but I am not sure about GUE style kicking
3) what size should I order, given my foot size and drysuit usage?
4) are my newly acquired GUE friends going to throw me overboard? ( so new to GUE, and cheating already!)
5) one final word to Bob: I am the guy who called you from Switzetland, when production had just stopped. I am glad you made it back, my friend. I would love to buy a pair of your fins!!!!

thank you very much for any input.

Luganodiver

 

[BabyDuck]

you might find this thread worth reading. it's from a cave/hogarthian perspective, but not gue's dir, just so you know.

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/force-fin/302612-force-fin-review-die-hard-jet-fin-user.html

 

[kathydee]

Congrats on your recent Fundies pass!

I'm not sure you need to give up on the Jets.

When I swapped my splits for Jets, it took a while for foot strength to develop. I remember pain, cramps, etc in the beginning, which eased up as muscle developed and my technique refined.

I was able to dive the smaller foot blade of the Large Jets for a while. The smaller blade surface was easier to manage in the water while muscles developed. Later I switched back to the XL fins for more power.

Good luck!

 

[TN Traveler]

The best fin for your style of diving would be the "Hockey Fin". It meets all the GUE requirements, is probably more powerful than the Jets and will not overstress knees, ankles, hips, etc.
You would want XXLs and can size them down as needed with the comfort inserts.

 

[danvolker]

Well, this is my first post, one has to start somewhere, right?

I am a 54 YO diver with 35 years of diving experience. I have recently taken (and Passed!) a GUE Fundie course, where I have learned all propulsion techniques.

No mayor issues there, but I find the Jetfin to be very hard on my foot. I was a happy user of Seawing Novas and then Gorillas prior to buying the Jetfins for the Fundie course. These fins allowed me to flutter my way upstream in strong currents. I can still do it with the jetfins at the cost of murdering my feet and ankles. I have an European 45 size, and I wear a DUI drysuit ( what else?) with turbo soles.

i regard myself as rather powerful swimmer.

now to the questions:

1) is there a Forcefin that would allow me to frog kick, but also to do helicopter turns and backward kick?
2) is the extra force fin still produced? I like its specs but I am not sure about GUE style kicking
3) what size should I order, given my foot size and drysuit usage?
4) are my newly acquired GUE friends going to throw me overboard? ( so new to GUE, and cheating already!)
5) one final word to Bob: I am the guy who called you from Switzetland, when production had just stopped. I am glad you made it back, my friend. I would love to buy a pair of your fins!!!!

thank you very much for any input.

Luganodiver

I think you would like the excellerating force fins the best....they and the hockey fins are both spectacular at all speeds, and very efficient, but I found more precise, fundies level control, in the excellerating force fin than the hockey fin.
The problem I had with the hockey fin, in a GUE fundies setting, is for hovering with no front or backwards movement...when you just want to be still and without motion, you need a control surface on the fin that allows very slight motions of the fin to impart significant stabilizing type motions.....Jets to this very well, excedllerating force fins do also. The hockeys I think are optimized for fast forward or backward or rapid motion..or even slow motion...just not optimized for no motion

Now in the real world, I find few situations where this means anything to me, and I dive a h*ll of a lot more "in ocean" than most divers do. Now if you are going for cave, I can see how this is a big deal.
Crazy, 15 minutes deep into a shipwreck, with lines and original exploration traverses, probably here to.
Just swimming through a big living room like interior of a wreck like the mispah or the zion, I don't think so.

The bigger issue in the REAL WORLD, is how the fins will work for you in the environments you are most concerned with.

 

[Bob Evans]

babyduck, Thanks for sharing the review by daaquamater on the SD-1. I felt his opinion was fair due to the limited time that was put in testing. This Force Fin model, SD-1 was made for special for our Military after 911. I felt that no one else could make the best American Made fin for our Service Men and Women..and I did. Funny, you and other's bring up Jet Fins ( I used mine for 20 years, cert. 1966) several Military units world wide and here in America have now purchase this model over Jet or Rocket fins. So the moral of the story is time ways shorts out the .....and the ......

 

[Luganodiver]

I think you would like the excellerating force fins the best....they and the hockey fins are both spectacular at all speeds, and very efficient, but I found more precise, fundies level control, in the excellerating force fin than the hockey fin.
The problem I had with the hockey fin, in a GUE fundies setting, is for hovering with no front or backwards movement...when you just want to be still and without motion, you need a control surface on the fin that allows very slight motions of the fin to impart significant stabilizing type motions.....Jets to this very well, excedllerating force fins do also. The hockeys I think are optimized for fast forward or backward or rapid motion..or even slow motion...just not optimized for no motion

Now in the real world, I find few situations where this means anything to me, and I dive a h*ll of a lot more "in ocean" than most divers do. Now if you are going for cave, I can see how this is a big deal.
Crazy, 15 minutes deep into a shipwreck, with lines and original exploration traverses, probably here to.
Just swimming through a big living room like interior of a wreck like the mispah or the zion, I don't think so.

The bigger issue in the REAL WORLD, is how the fins will work for you in the environments you are most concerned with.

thank you, Danvolker. Unfortunately the Excellereting have disappeared from the FF website. Should I get the Extra Force Fins instead?

 

[danvolker]

thank you, Danvolker. Unfortunately the Excellereting have disappeared from the FF website. Should I get the Extra Force Fins instead?

I have no experience with that model. To me, because I am a cyclist and I like the fins to be able to do as much as I might want them to, it is important to me to get fins like the hockeys or the excellerating FF's, because I can't "over-kick" them....they don't spagetti like virtually all traditional scuba fins do.. and like the original force fin ( kind of does)....The originals just are too low a gear, meaning a really insanely fast cadence is needed if you want to go really fast...the originals never actually lose shape and function with added power, they are just "geared" for using less power per kick, so only "push" so much per kick. Bob created a whole series of differently "geared" fins, which I think is very smart, and the Freedive guys do too. This is the way you can match a fin to a diver. Now your job is to find out which Force fin matches to you the most
Bob knows a lot of people....someone, somewhere, will let you try a pair.

 

[Luganodiver]

I have no experience with that model. To me, because I am a cyclist and I like the fins to be able to do as much as I might want them to, it is important to me to get fins like the hockeys or the excellerating FF's, because I can't "over-kick" them....they don't spagetti like virtually all traditional scuba fins do.. and like the original force fin ( kind of does)....The originals just are too low a gear, meaning a really insanely fast cadence is needed if you want to go really fast...the originals never actually lose shape and function with added power, they are just "geared" for using less power per kick, so only "push" so much per kick. Bob created a whole series of differently "geared" fins, which I think is very smart, and the Freedive guys do too. This is the way you can match a fin to a diver. Now your job is to find out which Force fin matches to you the most
Bob knows a lot of people....someone, somewhere, will let you try a pair.

thank you, Dan. I am a cyclist too and since I live in Switzerland, I am aware of the importance of gears and ratios when I am riding uphill. Having said that, I will try to test some force fin while working on my jets.

 

[BabyDuck]

babyduck, Thanks for sharing the review by daaquamater on the SD-1. I felt his opinion was fair due to the limited time that was put in testing. This Force Fin model, SD-1 was made for special for our Military after 911.

you're welcome.

Funny, you and other's bring up Jet Fins...

no, i didn't - or are you referring to the op?