Film for Beginners

[ScubyDoo]

Hello to all my foto friends. I have a new Sea & Sea MX-10 which I plan to take with me to the Bahamas next week. Ive watched the video which comes separately and taken Marty Snydermans online course, both of which recommend using Kodak Max 400 film for beginners such as myself. Through earlier searches in this forum Ive found that many if not most divers recommend using Kodak Royal Gold film instead. I recently shot 3 rolls of Royal Gold 400 at Vortex Springs (picking up the pictures later today). My problem is that Im unable to find Royal Gold 400 in 36 exposures. I found plenty of places which sell the 24 exp. film. Ive also been told that Kodak is discontinuing the Royal Gold 400 in order to push the 200. I assume most people who purchase Royal Gold film are experienced enough they dont need 400 film??? I'm wondering if perhaps I should just go ahead and get 200 speed film since I'd very much like the option of doing some enlargements in the unlikely event that any of my Bahamas photos actually turn out good. I guess Im asking for suggestions from the pros out there.

Kodak Royal Gold 400 - 24 exp. (right film-not enough exposures)
Kodak Max Gold 400 - 36 exp. (ok film, plenty of exposures)
Kodak Royal Gold 200 - 36 exp (risky speed for beginner, enlargement options)

I want to take lots of pictures and obviously I cant change rolls underwater, so I really want the 36 exposures. The 24 exp. rolls were too little for the Vortex dives. I had to hold back on picture taking in order to make the roll last thru the dive. Im sure this issue will magnify itself diving the Bahamas since there will many more photo opportunities. Thanks in advance for your comments and suggestions.

 

[Lonely Boy]

My comment is go with Gold 200.

All of my photos were taken with Gold 200 and Gold 100 (not Royal Gold):
http://www.geocities.com/hmlai88/

 

[Dee]

Go with the Royal Gold 100 or 200. I don't know why film speed should have anything to do with your experience level. I started out shooting ASA100 and seldom used anything else except slide film. I always found 200 and 400 too grainy for me.

 

[KyPete]

So, it sounds like 100 or 200 is best for enlargements? So far I've only shot 400...my MX-10 recommends either 100 or 400.

Not to be totally stupid, but what difference does the speed make and why do some think 100/200 is more difficult for newbies?

 

[FallenMatt]

i am not a photographer so i might be wrong
heck.. i always might be wrong

"speed" is the sensitivity of the film. The higher the speed the less light you need for proper expousure. So with high enough speed in theory even if you don't have "enough" light you will still get the picture.

the flip side is that to get the higher sensitivity you end up with lower resolution - more "grainy" pictures. This actually matters on my scanner where trying to scan negatives in fairly medium res produces blury results (my scanner has better max resolution than the Kodak Max 400 negative provides)

anyway, my take is that with higher speed you can do more mistakes with lighting the scene and you still get the picture

... as i said i know diddly squat about photography

 

[ScubyDoo]

FallenMatt once bubbled...
"speed" is the sensitivity of the film. The higher the speed the less light you need for proper expousure. So with high enough speed in theory even if you don't have "enough" light you will still get the picture.

I think Matt is right, at least from what I recall reading in Marty Snydermans online MX-10 course. Novices like myself are not experienced enough to interpret the lighting conditions properly, nor are we able to adjust the f-stops accordingly. The faster speed films are to us like a handicap is to golfers. Like many of you have stated though, its a tradeoff. The higher speed films are more grainy (lower resolution), so the the pictures are not as colorful and crisp, and enlargements are difficult if not impossible. If I use a 100 or 200 speed film however, the picture might be real crisp and clear, but may be too dark or too light, unless of course I stick with the camera and strobes "auto" feature, which may be the best route to take. These will be my first salt water photographs so Im not really wanting to experiment with different f-stops anyway, unless I try to do some silhoutte shots which Im sure I will.

 

[Dee]

ScubyDoo once bubbled...


I think Matt is right, at least from what I recall reading in Marty Snydermans online MX-10 course. Novices like myself are not experienced enough to interpret the lighting conditions properly, nor are we able to adjust the f-stops accordingly. The faster speed films are to us like a handicap is to golfers. Like many of you have stated though, its a tradeoff. The higher speed films are more grainy (lower resolution), so the the pictures are not as colorful and crisp, and enlargements are difficult if not impossible. If I use a 100 or 200 speed film however, the picture might be real crisp and clear, but may be too dark or too light, unless of course I stick with the camera and strobes "auto" feature, which may be the best route to take. These will be my first salt water photographs so Im not really wanting to experiment with different f-stops anyway, unless I try to do some silhoutte shots which Im sure I will.

It's the experimenting that allows you to learn things! Seriously, please take even just one dive and 'experiment' with the f/stops and aperatures. It's really not hard and if you bracket your shots, you'll have a one in three shot at the perfect exposure. It's alot more rewarding when you know you set the exposures for your pics and didn't depend on the camera to choose it for you!

 

[Big Blue One]

One of the best colour intense print films you can use is the Fuji "Reala". This is a standard print film who's colour balance and reproduction is a notch up on the standard Fuji print film range and beats any other prints film (irrespective of speed) hands down.

Kodak do not offer a similar alternative in their range.

However you can usually only get this at Fuji only stockists and then not always - but when you find one you stick to it.

The problem with ISO 400 film is that you trade off resolution for speed. The higher speed films work better in dim light but you will often find a graininess especially if enlarging.

With a simple camera ISO 200 provides the best trade mix of speed for colour intensity for the amateur. This is usually the better option for photos you know will have good lighting (even if strobe) rather than needing to capture a fast moving fish in action (like laying up hoops) !!

The next notch up from print is slide.

Similarly Kodak is known for it's quality in the blues while Fuji is often better in the reds and greens. If you use colour correcting and want true to colour then knock off a roll of Fuji film as a side-by-side comparison.

As mentioned earlier, while you are learning keep changing and experimenting until you get what YOU think is best for you.

 

[ScubyDoo]

All great advice. I think the thing to do might be to take a little bit of everything and give each type a try and judge the results. I think I'll take a couple rolls each of

Kodak Royal Gold 400
Kodak Royal Gold 200
Kodak Royal Gold 100
Fuji Reala 400
Fuji Reala 200

Im only going to be doing about 6 dives so much of this film will be used for topside photographs. I just got my first U/W photos back from the developer from my trip to Vortex and Morrison Springs. I had a few shots that turned out okay, but for the most part I did a poor job of judging distance, so my subjects tended to be a little dark. Also I had a problem with backscatter due to all the novice divers kicking up a lot of silt. I did have one shot that I really liked mostly because it was very clear (no backscatter whatsoever). Its a picture at Morrison Spring where I dropped down and layed on a ledge and shot back into the cave. The cave was completely dark, but my strobe lit it up real nice.

http://community.webshots.com/sym/image5/8/9/33/71680933hKEdtP_ph.jpg

 

[TedJ]

My wife and I have used MX-10s for about the last six years in Grand Cayman and Bonaire. We have tried all the Kodak films from Max 800, 400, 200 to the Royal Gold Series. Cathy Church's operation recommended 800 at one point but we didn't like the graininess as others have pointed out. We finally settled on a combination of 100 and 200 Kodak and it didn't seem to make much of a difference. What made more of a difference in the quality of our photos was GETTING CLOSE!!! We finally figured out that if its much beyond arm's length its not going to come out as what you saw with your eyes.

I've now switched to an Olympus 5050 digital and she has a Nikonos V. She also switched to Fuji Velvia 50 and Provia 100 slide film. She's very happy with the results of the slide film.