Drop the freaking weights!

[Akimbo]

…Where are you reading/hearing about such incidents ? This is news to me, and I follow Dandy Don's reports closely. Why couldn't it actually be narcosis ?

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/accidents-incidents/377698-two-fatalities-monterey.html

I was diving from a different boat on this day when I heard over the radio that two divers were overdue on an old friend’s boat. Another skipper was driving that day. I was with my friend a few hours later when we heard over the radio that bodies were recovered. We both met his boat when it returned and while the Coast Guard was conducting interviews.

The boat re-anchored on GPS coordinates to start the search. Both divers were found side-by-side, within a few feet of the anchor. The depth was a little over 60'. I believe that their instruments indicated that their cylinders were empty. Neither dumped weight. Unfortunately the rescue crew jettisoned both rigs at the surface so divers could be recovered and rushed ashore. Both rigs sank and were recovered later. Weights were still intact and the BCs were operable.

The boat had something like 20 divers aboard. These two guys were already certified so not part of the class from their high school that was also onboard. All the cylinders were the boat’s and were filled off the same air trailer. I believe it was the second dive that day. Lots of testing took place and it does not look like bad gas was the cause.

To my astonishment, I learned that it was not uncommon for buddy-teams to be found like this. The vast majority of these cases were in less than 100' of water, thus not a narcosis-induced phenomenon. Very sad on many levels.

 

[scubafanatic]

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/accidents-incidents/377698-two-fatalities-monterey.html

I was diving from a different boat on this day when I heard over the radio that two divers were overdue on an old friend’s boat. Another skipper was driving that day. I was with my friend a few hours later when we heard over the radio that bodies were recovered. We both met his boat when it returned and while the Coast Guard was conducting interviews.

The boat re-anchored on GPS coordinates to start the search. Both divers were found side-by-side, within a few feet of the anchor. The depth was a little over 60'. I believe that their instruments indicated that their cylinders were empty. Neither dumped weight. Unfortunately the rescue crew jettisoned both rigs at the surface so divers could be recovered and rushed ashore. Both rigs sank and were recovered later. Weights were still intact and the BCs were operable.

The boat had something like 20 divers aboard. These two guys were already certified so not part of the class from their high school that was also onboard. All the cylinders were the boat’s and were filled off the same air trailer. I believe it was the second dive that day. Lots of testing took place and it does not look like bad gas was the cause.

To my astonishment, I learned that it was not uncommon for buddy-teams to be found like this. The vast majority of these cases were in less than 100' of water, thus not a narcosis-induced phenomenon. Very sad on many levels.

Any educated guesses as to why this happens ?

 

[Steve_C]

Bad gas management and feeling like they have to get back to the anchor rather than making an open water ascent causes some of them. I have got lost a couple times and could not find the anchor. When I reach a certain point I head up. Better to be at the surface with an inflated SMB.

 

[Akimbo]

Any educated guesses as to why this happens ?

I haven’t heard any viable theories that don’t circle back to standard training practices. Full Disclosure: I am an old-school curmudgeon on this issue.

---------- Post added October 12th, 2013 at 05:52 PM ----------

Bad gas management and feeling like they have to get back to the anchor rather than making an open water ascent causes some of them...

This is less probable in a place like Monterey during the spring. Kelp is everywhere, thus natural down-lines. Think about it: two healthy divers simultaneously running out of air in 60' of water and unable to make it to the surface???

I can even accept a panic-induced embolism if they both made it to the surface, but laying side-by-side on the bottom? The problem is nobody knows for sure that they were out of air when they lost consciousness. It isn’t plausible that one ran out of air and they swam around looking for the anchor line sharing an octo until they both passed out.

 

[wedivebc]

Dang, that sucks. 500 is doable. One would guess there is a recovery dive being planned?

500' in tropical waters with surface support and a nice benign location like a cave is doable but in 42 degF with current and a ferry lane overhead it's just not worth the risk

 

[down4fun]

500' in tropical waters with surface support and a nice benign location like a cave is doable but in 42 degF with current and a ferry lane overhead it's just not worth the risk

That's true. I forget we aren't all in florida.

 

[tracydr]

I'm not small, I'd say average size, but having just switched from jacket BC to BP/W, I'm also trying to find the best places for all my weight. With the jacket I had weight on the cam bands, belt and pockets, with both the belt and pockets ditchable. Now I have the plate, with weights on the cam bands and belt, so only the belt is ditchable, and the belt is under the crotch strap. Does it make sense to add pockets to the waist belt and/or harness, and move weight from the belt?

I have pockets on my harness, the Halcyon pockets. They're very nice. I just don't have room for both a can light and a pocket on my right hand hip. My husband is not that big of a guy yet he has plenty of room on his waist for the same pockets. In fact, I can wear the same size jeans as him. I guess the difference must be wear my harness hits my waist and how wide I am at that point.

 

[raftingtigger]

I have found that 16 pounds on a weight belt kills my lower back, making more than one or two dives an impossible dream.

As I moved into a proper horizontal trim I noticed the small of my back hurting after a few dives. My 10# belt rested across the small of my back and in a horizontal trim caused to much pressure. I found a simple solution. I dive a weight harness and simply lengthened the shoulder straps and moved the weights down to my hips (not possible without the shoulder straps) and have further secured the position with a crotch strap. Each 5# weight is individually ditch-able by pulling a handle.

 

[Ayisha]

...I'm still working my issues out but a weighted STA,steel tank and steel backplate ( my short plate is two pounds lighter than a regular) seems to be a good start. I'd like to figure out a better system similar to the Halcyon pockets for my ditch able weights. Something that hopefully doesn't take up so much room around the waist.
Surely other small cold water divers have this problem?

Yes, I'm a petite cold water diver and have the same system as you, and had the same issues as you with it. I solved the trim issue with tank mounted trim weight pockets.

No, they're not ditchable, but all of your weight won't be in them - up to 10 lbs. You can still have the rest of your weight where you can reach it, and as Jim L said, you only need to remove a couple of lbs to become positive. That's assuming that you can't swim up your rig without removing any weight with an empty BC.

You can see the Halcyon tank mounted trim weights here: BC System Weighting | Halcyon

 

[Shasta_man]

Weight belts aren't a universal panacea because the damn things can slip off if you don't have hips and that includes skinny and fat people. Sure crank it down but you're in a vise to keep it on.