DIR- Generic Drinking the DIR koolaid

[gobuyastick]

One thing thats always irked me about a hardcore gue friend of mine is their insistance of diving in guage mode on their shearwater and using the 130 rule for all of the rec dives we do together as opposed to actually using it to display NDL and whatnot. I feel theyre so far in the coolaid that their refusal to use a computer on a rec dive is silly. Its weird to me but to each their own, i hope they like their 900$ bottom timer..

 

[rjack321]

Should I dig out the JJ rant on computers ??

So speaking of critical thinking...

If you check the date on when these "rants" were written you might notice they are "old". Put on your wayback machine and go find a diverite niktek He or a one of the cochran pucks from that era. Wonder why there are no "just get a nikek he computer and never worry about it again" threads on SB? Yea because they sucked and haven't been on the market in a decade.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

@PullYourselfTogetherMan,

I hope you are finding this entertaining!

 

[Lorenzoid]

One thing thats always irked me about a hardcore gue friend of mine is their insistance of diving in guage mode on their shearwater and using the 130 rule for all of the rec dives we do together as opposed to actually using it to display NDL and whatnot. I feel theyre so far in the coolaid that their refusal to use a computer on a rec dive is silly. Its weird to me but to each their own, i hope they like their 900$ bottom timer..

Has this friend taken GUE courses beyond Fundies? I think a lot of people leave Fundies with the impression that GUE "forbids" computers, as though they feel the GUE Scuba Police are watching them, and if they deviate from what was taught in class, they are not "real" GUE divers. See Post #32 above, where Kate relates a story from her Tech 2 class. The Rule of 130 works great for many dives I do, but I have to believe I am like most GUE rec divers in that I also keep an eye on what my computer says.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

From Equipment Configuration | Global Underwater Explorers. I have no idea when this was first written, but it is still up on the GUE website.

1. Dive computers tend to induce significant levels of diver dependence, and undermine the awareness essential to all diving, but particularly essential to divers just beginning decompression diving.
2. Dive computers prohibit proper planning; they discourage divers from “studying” the impact of various mixtures and decompression choices.
3. Dive computers are of little educational benefit because they promote neither questioning nor proper planning discussions.
4. Dive computers often use algorithms that heavily pad decompression time; this sometimes results in odd and ridiculous levels of conservatism.
5. Dive computers are expensive, and prevent divers with limited resources from purchasing truly useful equipment.
6. Dive computers significantly limit the likelihood that divers will track their residual nitrogen groups, leaving them less informed in the event of computer failure.
7. Dive computers do not allow for diving helium in any format but the bulkiest and most questionable. It is very likely that new helium-based decompression computers will be inordinately conservative and suffer from all the limitations of air and Nitrox dive computers.
8. Dive computers often generate longer decompressions than an astute, well-educated, experienced diver generates.
9. Dive computers often confuse matters by providing the diver with too much useless information, sometimes even obscuring depth and time in favor of blinking CNS and/or decompression limitations.
10. Some dive computers become very difficult to use if a decompression stop has been violated. Some computers will lock up completely, while others will just beep or generate erroneous and distracting information.
11. Dive computers do not allow the educated diver to properly modify his/her decompression profile to account for advances in knowledge, e.g., the use of deeper stops in a decompression profile.
12. Dive computers do not offer divers much flexibility to generate profiles with varying conservatism. For example, the right mix would allow 100 minutes at 60 ft rather than 60 minutes at 60 ft, but a diver might prefer to do one or the other or a hybrid of the two. Computers confuse this issue by not providing divers with the proper information.
13. Dive computer users often ignore table proficiency and therefore do not learn to read tables properly. When faced with a situation where they can't dive a computer (e.g., failure or loss) these divers are seriously handicapped.

 

[Lorenzoid]

From Equipment Configuration | Global Underwater Explorers. I have no idea when this was first written, but it is still up on the GUE website.

I know it's there, but is it an orphan page? How did you get to that page from the home page www.gue.com?

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

I know it's there, but is it an orphan page? How did you get to that page from the home page www.gue.com?

I tend to google things. Easier than navigating most websites.

Is it really hard to remove orphaned web pages? What would that take? 15 minutes? (And I’m being generous)

 

[rjack321]

From Equipment Configuration | Global Underwater Explorers. I have no idea when this was first written, but it is still up on the GUE website.

1. Dive computers tend to induce significant levels of diver dependence, and undermine the awareness essential to all diving, but particularly essential to divers just beginning decompression diving.
2. Dive computers prohibit proper planning; they discourage divers from “studying” the impact of various mixtures and decompression choices.
3. Dive computers are of little educational benefit because they promote neither questioning nor proper planning discussions.
4. Dive computers often use algorithms that heavily pad decompression time; this sometimes results in odd and ridiculous levels of conservatism.
5. Dive computers are expensive, and prevent divers with limited resources from purchasing truly useful equipment.
6. Dive computers significantly limit the likelihood that divers will track their residual nitrogen groups, leaving them less informed in the event of computer failure.
7. Dive computers do not allow for diving helium in any format but the bulkiest and most questionable. It is very likely that new helium-based decompression computers will be inordinately conservative and suffer from all the limitations of air and Nitrox dive computers.
8. Dive computers often generate longer decompressions than an astute, well-educated, experienced diver generates.
9. Dive computers often confuse matters by providing the diver with too much useless information, sometimes even obscuring depth and time in favor of blinking CNS and/or decompression limitations.
10. Some dive computers become very difficult to use if a decompression stop has been violated. Some computers will lock up completely, while others will just beep or generate erroneous and distracting information.
11. Dive computers do not allow the educated diver to properly modify his/her decompression profile to account for advances in knowledge, e.g., the use of deeper stops in a decompression profile.
12. Dive computers do not offer divers much flexibility to generate profiles with varying conservatism. For example, the right mix would allow 100 minutes at 60 ft rather than 60 minutes at 60 ft, but a diver might prefer to do one or the other or a hybrid of the two. Computers confuse this issue by not providing divers with the proper information.
13. Dive computer users often ignore table proficiency and therefore do not learn to read tables properly. When faced with a situation where they can't dive a computer (e.g., failure or loss) these divers are seriously handicapped.

GUE started in 1998. That might have actually predated the agency, but at the very latest it was late 1990s or early 2000s. For comparison, Shearwater research released their first major market entry computer the Predator in 2009.

Ps some of those criticisms are still very much valid.

 

[PfcAJ]

From Equipment Configuration | Global Underwater Explorers. I have no idea when this was first written, but it is still up on the GUE website.

1. Dive computers tend to induce significant levels of diver dependence, and undermine the awareness essential to all diving, but particularly essential to divers just beginning decompression diving.
2. Dive computers prohibit proper planning; they discourage divers from “studying” the impact of various mixtures and decompression choices.
3. Dive computers are of little educational benefit because they promote neither questioning nor proper planning discussions.
4. Dive computers often use algorithms that heavily pad decompression time; this sometimes results in odd and ridiculous levels of conservatism.
5. Dive computers are expensive, and prevent divers with limited resources from purchasing truly useful equipment.
6. Dive computers significantly limit the likelihood that divers will track their residual nitrogen groups, leaving them less informed in the event of computer failure.
7. Dive computers do not allow for diving helium in any format but the bulkiest and most questionable. It is very likely that new helium-based decompression computers will be inordinately conservative and suffer from all the limitations of air and Nitrox dive computers.
8. Dive computers often generate longer decompressions than an astute, well-educated, experienced diver generates.
9. Dive computers often confuse matters by providing the diver with too much useless information, sometimes even obscuring depth and time in favor of blinking CNS and/or decompression limitations.
10. Some dive computers become very difficult to use if a decompression stop has been violated. Some computers will lock up completely, while others will just beep or generate erroneous and distracting information.
11. Dive computers do not allow the educated diver to properly modify his/her decompression profile to account for advances in knowledge, e.g., the use of deeper stops in a decompression profile.
12. Dive computers do not offer divers much flexibility to generate profiles with varying conservatism. For example, the right mix would allow 100 minutes at 60 ft rather than 60 minutes at 60 ft, but a diver might prefer to do one or the other or a hybrid of the two. Computers confuse this issue by not providing divers with the proper information.
13. Dive computer users often ignore table proficiency and therefore do not learn to read tables properly. When faced with a situation where they can't dive a computer (e.g., failure or loss) these divers are seriously handicapped.

A lot of that is still true though.

1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8,9,10, 13 are all VERY relevant.

 

[Lorenzoid]

Is it really hard to remove orphaned web pages? What would that take? 15 minutes? (And I’m being generous)

While they're at it, they should update JJ's book, because it contains that same "Baker's Dozen" bit about computers. My suspicion is that GUE knows the orphaned pages are still there, but some of those pages still have useful information--like the rest of the Gear Configuration page--and if someone is looking for specific information via a Google search or gets sent a link by someone who's already aware of it, there's no reason they should be denied seeing that information, however out of date a few bits of it may be. Think of it as an archive of old, but mostly still good, information.