Doubles and wetsuits

[MookieMoose]

Hi all.

I'm planning on moving into more technical diving, as my training and finances permit, but have been told by many people, some of them technical instructors for whom I have enormous respect, that the sooner one can get used to diving doubles, the better (ie less task-loading in courses such as adv. nitrox/deco procedures because you are already used to diving doubles). I don't currently own a drysuit, and as a student, it's not going to be in the bugdet anytime soon. As such can you good folk let me know what you think is safe and practical as far as diving doubles with a wetsuit goes? (If it makes any difference, the suit I usually dive is a 7mm fullsiut).

Thanks very much.

Cam

 

[pdoege]

You just need a source of redundant bouyancy and know how to use it.

You could just use a double wing or a liftbag reserved for bouyancy failure.

You probably want less negative doubles (like AL80s or fabers) so that it is easier to recover from a bouyancy failure.

Double 104s will sink you right quick if your wing fails. Smack! Right into the bottom.....

Peter

 

[simbrooks]

I am sure this will be nice and hotly contested!

Well my input, i currently dive my double HP-120's with a 5mm suit. I only do this in the springs/caves as the ones i frequent have a floor that IF my wing fails i can pretty much crawl out (or of course get a hand from my buddy). I can swim up my doubles, although barely when full (yes i have done it, although it was work from 30ft) and easily when they are nearer empty. I had contemplated getting a lift bag as back up floatation, but have yet to do that or try it in OW before thinking of taking it in the cave environment. Although i do dive this way, i am currently looking around for a drysuit for a little more redundant buoyancy just in case. It would have to be a pretty serious crash for me to lose all my air from my wing, so i call it a minor risk, but one i acknowledge. I dont intend to take my doubles in the salt until i have some redundancy as i cant just crawl out of the ocean back onto the boat

Many people will say dont do it, the main reasoning being that you lose buoyancy from your wetsuit with depth, making you even more negative than on the surface. IF you wing were to fail could you swim the rig up? Large tanks like those i have are heavy, smaller doubles like 72's are "acceptable" by most, AL80's are the most commonly suggested accompaniment to wetsuit diving due to their positive nature - just be sure to not wear all your weight as ditchable (just enough) as that could be a rocket ride waiting to happen!

This hopefully will be a moot point for me in a month or so when i manage to get around to finding, sizing and buying a drysuit

 

[Bobby]

Hi all.

I'm planning on moving into more technical diving, as my training and finances permit, but have been told by many people, some of them technical instructors for whom I have enormous respect, that the sooner one can get used to diving doubles, the better (ie less task-loading in courses such as adv. nitrox/deco procedures because you are already used to diving doubles). I don't currently own a drysuit, and as a student, it's not going to be in the bugdet anytime soon. As such can you good folk let me know what you think is safe and practical as far as diving doubles with a wetsuit goes? (If it makes any difference, the suit I usually dive is a 7mm fullsiut).

Thanks very much.

Cam

You should speak with the instructor that you plan on taking the class from. There are a lot of different views and opinions even with instructors. I commonly dive doubles with a wet suit and use a single wing, I carry lift bags when I do and can use them as back up bc device if needed. This is not a main stream way of doing it but it works for me. I like the classic wing and have not found a dual bladder that I like yet. If I am doing a dive that I feel that I realy need to have redundancy then at times I have put two classics sandwiched together.

 

[Quarrior]

I whole heartedly agree with learning how to use the tech gear before taking the classes, that's the same approach I am using. If figure when I take the classes, I will be learning what is taught in the classes much easier because I already use the gear.

As for the doubles when diving wet, I agree with the statements above about having a redundant lift source. Double bladder wing or some other means of making up for the lost bouyancy.

Two weeks ago I had the opportunity to do some diving with a wing that wasn't quite big enough to provide full bouyancy on the surface for me and my gear. I will admit it was nice having the drysuit so that I could put some extra air in it when floating on the surface.

As for the cost of drysuit, if you a person that can generally buy things off the rack and have them fit you, then you can probably get a good used drysuit for around 500.00USD, if you can afford that. Just post a "want to buy" here on SB and on The DecoStop. www.thedecostop.com I bought mine used, it's a bit long in the legs, but other than that it fits great and it's an awesome suit.

Good luck.

 

[Spectre]

this might help (I think there is some useful information mixed into the rant):

http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?p=842218#post842218

 

[Mako Mark]

AL80's are the most commonly suggested accompaniment to wetsuit diving due to their positive nature

In summer I dive double alumin 80's in fresh/saltwater caves with no weight and a 5mm steamer and have never had to walk out of the cave.

If I am doing a dive that I feel that I realy need to have redundancy then at times I have put two classics sandwiched together.

I have done this though when there is significant depth

This hopefully will be a moot point for me in a month or so when i manage to get around to finding, sizing and buying a drysuit

simbrooks, you are not becoming a gurly man are you?? just kidding, once you go dry, you will never go back, I love my DR 905 trilam..

 

[Doc Intrepid]

I'm planning on moving into more technical diving, as my training and finances permit, but have been told by many people, some of them technical instructors for whom I have enormous respect, that the sooner one can get used to diving doubles, the better (ie less task-loading in courses such as adv. nitrox/deco procedures because you are already used to diving doubles). I don't currently own a drysuit, and as a student, it's not going to be in the bugdet anytime soon. As such can you good folk let me know what you think is safe and practical as far as diving doubles with a wetsuit goes? (If it makes any difference, the suit I usually dive is a 7mm fullsiut).

Cam,

Get a set of double 80s. They are good to start on. Good in the ocean. Good with a wetsuit. Good for a wide variety of applications. Not pig-heavy as some sets of steels. And relatively inexpensive - used 80s can be found for little money. Its one way to get started thats both affordable and useful - you'll be using them long after you have other sets of doubles as well.

If you can afford the difference, Luxfer makes some nice brushed aluminum 80s that are neutral when empty. That eliminates having to wear about 4 lbs of weight, one place or another. With a wetsuit, thats something to consider.

Regards,

Doc

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I'll second (or maybe third) going with a set of AL 80's. Steel 72's also make great doubles to use with a wet suit as they are neautral when empty and only 4-5 lbs negative when full.

As long as you are properly weighted, you should still be able to swim with steel 72's or AL 80's up from the bottom in the event of a BC/wing failure.

I personally do not use a redundant aircell when diving wet with double 80's or 72's as I can swim them up off the bototm with no air in the wing. But I do carry a lift bag and reel that can be used in a pinch to get you off the bottom and to the surface where the wet suit will not be compressed. Some type of redundancy is nice to have in the event you end up with both a large leak in the wing and a missing fin.

 

[David P]

ok forgive my ignorance (new diver and lack of coffe this morning), I am a large guy, 6'4" with a chest that an off the shelf 3x wetsuit wont wrap around... I have so much buyancy due to the wet suit, I wear about 30lbs of lead. If I were to switch from aluminum tanks to steel, couldnt I drop some lead weight to compensate for the heavier tank and not have to worry about extra buyancy from a larger wing or carring a bag?