DM or Master Diver????

[JungleJoe]

I chose the Master Diver route,
After OW, then AOW, over the years I took up specialties that I felt would teach me something new, or help me if I wanted to do a dive that I could find training in ex:wreck

The specialties I chose were: Equipment Specialist, Night Diver, Ice Diver, Search & Recovery Diver, Wreck Diver, Rescue Diver, Deep Diver

I am also CPR & AED Trained and Certified which you have to be for Rescue.

I had more than enough dives by then from my regular rec. dives + all the dives from the classes. to meet my min 50 dives.

So yeah, I spent the 40.00 and got the card.

I just use that card now, more current pic of me, shows that I have done rescue (which I feel is important for others to know if I am needed, if they realize you need that to get master)

As stated in prior posts in here from others, there is additional liability imposed on DM's and above. Insurance is a definate if you go that route, and the career possibilities are not that great. Free air perhaps and some other perks, but in the Midwest here, the diving is different than it is in the ocean. People that live in high diving areas, would have more of a chance in career work.

I did not take specialty courses that I considered a waste of time and money. Underwater Naturlist, Boat diver, Dry suit (hell, I've been using a dry suit for years, why would I want a cert in that ???), and the other "fluffy" courses. Altho photog was something I thought about since I am just getting into doing photo's, started with film but that got too expensive for the trial and error, so I went digital. Cheaper to learn with and alot of fun. Also with draggin a camera along, I don't have to tell someone I saw a 3.5 ft bass, because I'll have a pic of it to make those poor fisherman drool.

Yeah I am sure there are ppl that get a masters and do it quick, and with the minimum dives etc. but Rescue by it'self is a nice tough course, if it's taught old style, and my instructor is old style to the core.

Since I don't forsee a future in being an instructor, On recreational only dives with our local dive club and with the newer people, I often get paired up with newer people to help them along if a DM is not diving that day. We try to always have a more experienced person buddied with someone who is less experienced. I do NOT participate in any training dives, nor would I ever stand in as a DM. Am I qualified to ???? by experience yes, by certification no..... Hence, I don't go there.

I dive to have fun !

I like to help ppl if they ask for it, and I like meeting new people and finding new people to dive with or learn about new places to go to, where they might of gone and I have not.

DM or MSD it's more of a question, are you going to want to get involved in teaching ??? or not. (From some of the threads on here about bad DM's, I wouldn't be ripping on someone with a Master Diver Cert, if the DM you just dove with is an idiot. I've read ALOT of threads complaining about bad DM's... go figure)

If you are not interested in teaching or becomming an instructor someday, the MSD is a fine point to end up at. From there you can go into higher level areas , tech diving etc..

Who has a better course ??? You can argue that one for hours..... just as politics or abortion rights. You will always have your diehards on one side of the fence and the other diehards on the other.... WHAT YOU FORGET IS...... WE ARE ALL DIVERS !!!!! that is all that should matter.

Experience and how you respect others, and realize that you never stop learning, no one know's it all..... Those are the things that matter. Usually the people with the most dives & experience under their belts, are not the ones spewing it to the moon every chance they get. They are kind folk, helpfull and if you take the time to ask them questions politely, you are sure to get some great tips.

Kudos to those types of divers, that is what I want to be seen as, a nice guy, helpfull and if there ever is an emergency, knowing that they got someone they can trust to help them out if doodoo hit the fan.

I shake my head when I see padi vs naui bashing, that is so imature....

In this thread I have seen some good points brought up, and some very imature sarcasm also.

Instead of arguing, who's better , or I've seen this blah blah... Why not try to give the person asking the question some UNBIASED feedback ???????

tis my 2 cents.

 

[Thalassamania]

It's quite simple. If you read my posts on this tread they are all factual and to the point. They are not pro-padi, nor are they anti-padi, they are, in fact, based on my experience and are factual, where facts are involved, and where it is a matter of opinion, base on the facts, not based on a love or hate for any agency.

I give you the respect to not deny that, what is it that keeps you for doing the same for folks who have reached different conclusions than you have?

On the otherhand, if someone had an "agenda" that means they are here only to promote that agenda. Take, for example, Thal's post about SAC rates. What did it add to the thread? Nothing, save to point out that one PADI MD isn't knowledgabe, about SAC rates.

I was not pointing out that one PADI MD was not knowledgeable about SAC rates, we all miscalculate one once in a while. I was pointing out (perhaps clumsily) that this PADI MD did know know that such a thing as a SAC rate existed. His question was, “What's a SAC rate and how do you calculate it?” The point here is not that he’s an idiot, or that his training was bad, but that here’s a case where an important concept slipped between all 5 specialty courses. That’s an example of why I feel that it is a sham of a program.

Do you see me poiting out every NAUD, YMCA, GUE, CMAS, SSI, etc diver I know who reached a certain level without knowledge of every aspect of the sport? No, you haven't because I have great reapect for ALL of those agencies.

And I have little or no respect for ANY of those agencies, PADI is just one offender amongst many and perhaps the most egregious one, so the easiest to tale shots at.

Did this thread go off topic? You bet. But did it go off topic enough that it should become an us vs them thread? No, not until god got involvled.

The last refuge of the scoundrel, when you can’t make your case on the merits ... call people names, nice touch for a board moderator.

 

[HammerNoMore]

Why not try to give the person asking the question some UNBIASED feedback ???????

tis my 2 cents.

Great post Joe. And I've been doing just that. I've pointed out both good and bad sides to the PADI MD card.

You sound like a great diver. You've sought out the training you thought you needed and eventually it lead to spend the extra monay for MD or not. Since it's a small price why wouldn't you?

The original question was: Should I go for MD or DM, I'm this " " close. My answer is that if those are the choices and you want to continue to learn, go for DM. If, like you, you are there and happy with your status, then, yep, you are right, why not spend the money and get the card? Heck I've spent more on lunch.

I took the oringal question in this vein: "What will give me the most knowledge, 1 more specialty or DM".

I said it then and I'll say it now. Wether not not you plan to "go pro", you'll get a lot more out of DM than you will out of any single rec specialty.

This thread has gone from which to choose to a NAUI vs PADI fest and that is not right. For my part, I'm sorry but I maintain that I've kept an even keel on things.

IMHO, and this is to the mods reading, this question has been, asked, anwered an extrapolated into non exitance.

This thread should be closed.

James

 

[Thalassamania]

This thread has gone from which to choose to a NAUI vs PADI fest and that is not right. For my part, I'm sorry but I maintain that I've kept an even keel on things.

IMHO, and this is to the mods reading, this question has been, asked, anwered an extrapolated into non exitance.

This thread should be closed.

No one in the thead, that I can recall, said "boo PADI" and "yeah NAUI." That was never at issue. Some folks, myself included, suggested alternatives (and I seem to recall suggesting programs from three different agencies). No one called names or denigrated anyone until you showed up. And when name calling doesn't do it for you you want a Deus ex machina solution from your fellow mods. Unbelieveable.

 

[Diver Dennis]

No I don't. IMHO SAC rate calulations are important to divers who need to know such information. That list is restricted to those who need to know that they can man a certain dive on a certain amount of air.

That need is technical. I.E. not recreational. By my definition a recreational diver should be able to end a dive at any time. Since MD is a recreational certificate, an MD does not need a finite time for the dive.

As an instructor I make many such decisions. Is XXX pressure enough to get me through this training dive? I don't go calculate my SAC against the depth each time, I base it on my experience. I know that XXX pressure is enough to do the dive with time for problems built in or not. Can I calculate my SAC, you bet. Is it a required skill? No way.

James

I'm not quite sure I understand this. Do you mean the SAC rates for a recreational diver are not important?

 

[Thalassamania]

OK, discussion over. SAC rates are a technical diving subject outside the ken of recreational divers.

 

[HammerNoMore]

I'm not quite sure I understand this. Do you mean the SAC rates for a recreational diver are not important?

What I am saying is that by definition, a rec diver can surface at any point for any reason. Do you disagree, if so we should expand this to what is a rec diver.

If you can end a dive at any time, you do not NEED to know your SAC rate.

James

 

[Diver Dennis]

How do you teach dive planning then, just on time and depth?

 

[Thalassamania]

No, and you don't NEED to plan your dive, and you don't NEED to know how to clear your mask, you can just surface, and you don't really NEED to know any of those messy gas laws ...

 

[ch0ppersrule]

I went the Master Scuba Diver direction. I don't care to carry tanks and gear for other people. I want to dive for fun, not for work. Not saying being a DM isn't fun, but as I said " I don't want to carry gear and tanks for other people".