In a fair world it shouldn't affect their business at all, if the business resides in the United States they would likely if not be sued for discrimination of some sort, than at least sued for embarrassment, stress and mental duress done to the fat person denied service, if not that at the very least they would likely have their businesses reputation soiled by the fat person on face book and trip advisor crying over the 'discrimination' against fat people.
Diving, Fitness, Obesity and Personal Rights
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In a fair world it shouldn't affect their business at all, if the business resides in the United States they would likely if not be sued for discrimination of some sort, than at least sued for embarrassment, stress and mental duress done to the fat person denied service, if not that at the very least they would likely have their businesses reputation soiled by the fat person on face book and trip advisor crying over the 'discrimination' against fat people.
I like the idea but...seriously? AFAIK certification is valid for life. When exactly should this test be administered and by whom? How often? Maybe we can make this a government function.
I was on a boat recently with an overweight, out of condition smoker who died in the water. Ironically the test would probably have saved him. Better when divers go see their own doctors on a regular basis IMO.
Scubagolf
Contributor
Does anyone know if the 13 MET Bruce Protocol treadmill exercise test is the standard "treadmill" test used for physicals. I took one several months ago.
Better we self censor through knowledge and social contact. Good start would be the agencies regarding diving as a sport instead of an activity. Sports typically require physical activity. Vallet diving, dive masters holding fearful guests hands on a dive... all things that tend to build upon the dumbing down of diving, the idea that skills aren't a requirement, that that natural fear you might be feeling should be something to listen to instead of ignore.
I remember a thread here a long time ago when somebody brought up the subject of age, mobility, weight in regard to diving and dive ops helping old/infirm/over-weight/physically lacking type divers into and out of the water etc... the amount of incredulous outrage than anyone try to limit any divers ability to dive was alive and well. Praise upon praise being given to examples of dive operators who helped those incapable of helping themselves to dive and anyone who voiced any opinion otherwise being shouted down. In that discussion it was vocally apparent not to even speak about divers who shouldn't be diving anymore.
I remember a thread here a long time ago when somebody brought up the subject of age, mobility, weight in regard to diving and dive ops helping old/infirm/over-weight/physically lacking type divers into and out of the water etc... the amount of incredulous outrage than anyone try to limit any divers ability to dive was alive and well. Praise upon praise being given to examples of dive operators who helped those incapable of helping themselves to dive and anyone who voiced any opinion otherwise being shouted down. In that discussion it was vocally apparent not to even speak about divers who shouldn't be diving anymore.
Charles2
Contributor
I do this test every year. Never heard of the METs requirement, but I suspect that completion of stage 4 (4.2 mph @ 16% grade) would suffice for almost any requirement. This is the point where my heart rate starts getting up in the 140's. YMMV
I, too, see folks who are obviously out of shape going on dives for which they may not be prepared. Sometimes I stay close in case assistance is needed.
Because I am 67 yo, I also see a lot of folks that have that "Oh, no, don't put that guy in my group" look on their face when I am included on their dive boat. I love it when they start to ask about my experience after the first dive.
Hatul
Contributor
I like the idea but...seriously? AFAIK certification is valid for life. When exactly should this test be administered and by whom? How often? Maybe we can make this a government function.
I was on a boat recently with an overweight, out of condition smoker who died in the water. Ironically the test would probably have saved him. Better when divers go see their own doctors on a regular basis IMO.
I meant that as a personal goal for yourself as a diver. You can go to the gym, put on a heart-rate monitor, get on a treadmill and test yourself. 13 MET is running on a 15% grade at 4.2 mph. You can also have it done formally by your doctor while monitoring your EKG to see if there are signs of ischemia. This test is listed on the PADI medical clearance in the guidelines for physicians. If someone is young, healthy and active they don't need this. But if you're older and have doubts it's a good test to take before diving.
Normally when the treadmill test is done by cardiologists it's to look for ischemia as a sign of occult coronary disease. They hook you up with continuous EKG monitoring and take your blood pressure. You stop when you reach your max heart limit or have symptoms or EKG signs of ischemia.
Fat unfit folks tend not to have gym memberships...nor the urge to get tested!
lerpy
Contributor
So basically fat means unfit, what about the guys I see on boats, thin in shape, but having a smoke between dives, they are a heart attack risk as well. There are many factors that make a person unfit, and if we are talking risk, the older you are the higher risk you may be for a heart attack. So do we say that only people between 20 and 50 are allowed to dive, because heart attack risk goes up at that point. No we don't, I agree that it is the responsibility of the individual to be responsible for themselves in this manner. As for the ability of the crew to handle the overweight person, a person can be a lean, 300lbs solid muscle, they are going to be hard to manage as well. I got a few extra pounds on me that I definitely do not need, and I am aware of that, and I know that puts me at greater risk for various medical stuff, and yes I suppose I might be hard to deal with if unconscious or whatever, but I also play squash 4-5 nights a week, I go to the gym and lift weights pretty much daily, and I get on the treadmill and jog or brisk walk. I also walk to get groceries and run errands instead of drive, at the end of the day its our responsibility.
Sorry don't mean to rant, but I have also seen that look, "oh great this guy is diving with us", and ironically I have been involved in pulling other, seemingly more "in shape" people out of bad situations. I do believe that fitness is very important in this sport, and since moving into the tec world I have focused more on that need, as well I set my computer and plan my dives with a bit of extra conservatism.
Sorry don't mean to rant, but I have also seen that look, "oh great this guy is diving with us", and ironically I have been involved in pulling other, seemingly more "in shape" people out of bad situations. I do believe that fitness is very important in this sport, and since moving into the tec world I have focused more on that need, as well I set my computer and plan my dives with a bit of extra conservatism.
drrich2
Contributor
"I remember a thread here a long time ago when somebody brought up the subject of age, mobility, weight in regard to diving and dive ops helping old/infirm/over-weight/physically lacking type divers into and out of the water etc... the amount of incredulous outrage than anyone try to limit any divers ability to dive was alive and well. Praise upon praise being given to examples of dive operators who helped those incapable of helping themselves to dive and anyone who voiced any opinion otherwise being shouted down. In that discussion it was vocally apparent not to even speak about divers who shouldn't be diving anymore."
That's because Big Brother is alive, well and ready to rob us of Liberty, given the chance.
That's because Big Brother is alive, well and ready to rob us of Liberty, given the chance.
That's so silly on so many levels. We're talking about diving. It can be a physically demanding activity. If you're in bad shape and have an incident underwater, your chances of of survival are minimal.
A modicum of good health is required by every agency. This is more about insurance liability than big brother. Perhaps PADI should remove the RSTC health requirement too? Is that too much interference for you?
IF people followed simple rules, we could eliminate a load of 'incidents' while diving.
1. Don't lie on your RSTC medical. (You'd be surprised how many people do). I asked a 'healthy' student (no YES answers) once why she had a juice sachet in a BC pocket. "Oh I'm diabetic and that's In case my blood sugars go low", she answered cheerily.
2. Get an annual physical especially if you're fat and unfit. But people don't do that-especially if they're feeling fat and unfit. They don't want to hear what they already know. So goes that cycle until you have to drag them from the water onto the boat.
Perhaps stronger regulations ARE apropos...
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