Diver Indicted in 2003 GBR mishap

[bowlofpetunias]

Gimme a break she seems more interested in taking a pot shot at Australian legal system than the fact that an American citizen died under mysterious circumstances!

Honeymooner's dive death story full of holes: police - World - smh.com.au

 

[MikeFerrara]

Mike, I appreciate you hate PADI but you are taking this way too far.

Even if he couldn't equalise - which is possible but unlikely (what % of dives does this happen for for experienced divers on the 3rd dive of a day? 1%? I've only seen it half a dozen times with my buddies or groups in several hundred dives) -

In my experience, equalization problems are far more common including experienced divers and especially on multi-dive days.

then why on earth would he take 150 seconds to ascend 44 feet with a dying wife on the bottom? Clearly he was not panicked or he would have shot to the surface with super fast breathing.

I don't know. What I do know is that many divers just don't have much control over their ascent so some are too fast and some are too slow and some spend half the time going the wrong direction.

Have they published the computer data?

It would also have been trivial for him to inflate his wife's BCD and send her up.

Equally all rescue divers are taught how to bring an unresponsive diver up safely - I concur that not all certifed rescue divers are capable of doing so but I think most divers would be able to attract the attention of nearby divers and/or inflate the BCD at a minimum.

His actions (if they are as reported in this thread) are not consistent with a loving husband nor a panicked diver.

But they might be consistant with a diver who isn't very skilled. Look through accident reports. I think you'll see that buddy seperations are the norm in dives that result in fatality.

Are there any good excuses for these buddy seperations? I don't think so but it's still what usually happens. Many diving accidents sound to me like someone is guilty of murder but rarely is anyone called to task on it.

About the only thing here that I find surprising is the amout of attention and scrutiny the whole thing is getting. The diving performance seems about par for the course.

 

[bowlofpetunias]

yes I think this is a bit of chicken and egg. Large bubbles in the tissue rupture cells, cause localized bleeding, which cause florid or red colouration. Everyone is saying the same thing just saying it differently! Non of it is inconsistent with fact already reported.

 

[livinoz]

Yes, and I guess when all is said and done, it's not that important. We know the poor woman drowned.

 

[MikeFerrara]

Yes, and I guess when all is said and done, it's not that important. We know the poor woman drowned.

Did she drown? Did the examiner say what made him think the embolism took place after death?

Did witnesses report seeing her strugle while the husband was supposedly drowning her? Would you strugle if someone was drowning you?

I wonder if maybe the embolism was what incapacitated her in the first place.

 

[livinoz]

Did she drown? Did the examiner say what made him think the embolism took place after death?

Did witnesses report seeing her strugle while the husband was supposedly drowning her? Would you strugle if someone was drowning you?

I wonder if maybe the embolism was what incapacitated her in the first place.

All I can say is the pathologist's report to the coroner lists the cause of death as drowning.

 

[redrover]

When one diver drops lifeless to the ocean floor and her buddy swims away to make a lesuirely ascent from 14m?

Ok, wish I knew where the discussion was. Something about a CF, buddy separation then the guy asking who he should go to first. My guess (like it was a test question) was to ditch the buddy not paying any attention to any of it, at least they seemed to be handling it well, and go to the person that looked in trouble.


I meant to point out

• A previous discussion said first things first, don’t put your buddy at risk by abandoning them.
• Rec tropic vacation divers are generally viewed as not the sharpest knife in the drawer. And that includes not so prone to the tight team formation mentality. (Buddy? Buddy? Where art thou? Oh feces, heading the opposite direction…)
• I don’t recall the Doc level or experience, but if like the rest of us PADIers, he may not be real quick on the draw. He may be a ways away and not real sure what he is seeing, and then find the words to describe it later.
• In the photo…heck, doesn’t the person getting their photo taken look like a twit? And this is me underwater waving look at me. Notice below me you can see the woman that just died, just now. Don’t get to see that often, a real lucky photo op huh. And the Photographer was looking right at her while taking a smiley face picture. Just hope he wasn’t POed the Instructor ruined the shot swimming into it. (Well, I’d feel pretty bad.)
• I may be over generous in spirit but the only time I expected to see someone getting killed while on vacation was on some of the streets in NYC. I’d be hard pressed to come to the conclusion right away a honeymooning couple were locked in the throes of death. Some kinky role playing? I think. I’d have a hard time putting 2 + 2 together. The honeymooners hugging, and one unconcerned after…it just doesn’t make sense. And probably feel pretty bad about it if I was there, and wasn’t so quick on the uptake.

As for me, if I saw that woman laying the way she looked I’d like to think I’d at least think about it, consider my situation, before bolting down there.

But realistically Geoff H, I spent the bulk of my life being the protector of the people in one way or another. Having been The Man, it was quite annoying having to fend off the do gooders getting in the way and making it hard to get the job done quickly and correctly.
When I’m on vacation, and not expected to be The Man, I’m on vacation. So if I see something…first I take a step back and look for The Man and be alert for opportunity to be of assistance to The Man. If no The Man appears to be available, then, go and see what I can do and hope The Man shows up real soon.

In this situation (as I recall, not about to go read all of this again J) there was a guide of sorts. And apparently an Instructor in the vicinity. My experience is limited, but that situation is the norm for me and boat dives. I’m not expecting any of the professional divers anywhere near me be responsible for me. I do expect they are a good resource and at least more qualified than I to be The Man if unfortunate things happen. Apparently the Instructor was alert and came to the unsuccessful rescue. (Poor guy, bad day to be diving for a lot of people I expect.)

I hope what you are asking is how could the Doc not have been the one to have got to her soon enough she didn’t die, since he saw her in the process of getting to being dead.
All I’m saying is we (at least I) don’t know how close to this he was. What else he had on his plate. Nor do I know his feelings about being on vacation from being The Man. (My experience is there are two kinds of Doctors in a trauma such as this. Those that barge in with the sole qualification of podiatrist MD and those that offer they might be of use because they have experience pertaining to the situation. Guess which one I like better in my face when I am The Man? J)

And I will repeat myself: Have to say my reaction just a sentence into reading it was; what the heck is that guy (sounds like) just sitting there and just watching all this what he described as drama???

This whole event and chain just boggles the mind. If it was a Chevy Chase movie it would be funny.

 

[redrover]

Did she drown? Did the examiner say what made him think the embolism took place after death?

Did witnesses report seeing her strugle while the husband was supposedly drowning her? Would you strugle if someone was drowning you?

I wonder if maybe the embolism was what incapacitated her in the first place.

Mike the legal speak is quite tedious, but back there somewhere is a link to the official Coroner’s Report. He was considering if embolism, among the various ways a death can result from diving. His finding was drowning.

And I can see, didn’t think of it till you mentioned it….equalization being a problem…not that hubby can claim it for why he dawdled to get help mind you.
I can now see the intensity of my drive to ‘bolt’ as I said, could lead to a the faster I go, the slower I get kind of agony, mental as well as physical.
Glad you brought that up, just one more thing hope to remember, god forbid I have the need to.

 

[redrover]

Gimme a break she seems more interested in taking a pot shot at Australian legal system than the fact that an American citizen died under mysterious circumstances!

Honeymooner's dive death story full of holes: police - World - smh.com.au

(cough) I’m really wondering about the AU legal system too.

Not that I haven’t wondered at the USsses as well.

 

[livinoz]

Mike the legal speak is quite tedious, but back there somewhere is a link to the official Coroner’s Report. He was considering if embolism, among the various ways a death can result from diving. His finding was drowning.

And I can see, didn’t think of it till you mentioned it….equalization being a problem…not that hubby can claim it for why he dawdled to get help mind you.
I can now see the intensity of my drive to ‘bolt’ as I said, could lead to a the faster I go, the slower I get kind of agony, mental as well as physical.
Glad you brought that up, just one more thing hope to remember, god forbid I have the need to.

(cough) I’m really wondering about the AU legal system too.

Not that I haven’t wondered at the USsses as well.

Hmm! The Australian legal system will get there, eventually.

And to save searching, here's the link to the coroner's report:

http://www.courts.qld.gov.au/Watson20080620.pdf