Diver dies near Vashon Island

[wolf eel]

[lostinspaceThis sounds like a serious problem. However, if the diver did clutch his chest or heart at depth (and 110' is deep) it sounds to me more like the problem was either his heart, and/or his lungs directly rather than indirectly. Having seen deaths offshore (too many), it sounds like a cliche when you describe the typical heart attack victim but they are generally overweight, and generally smokers. The first symptoms of a heart attack often manifest as "indigestion" - something commonly found by over-eaters. These are minor warning attacks. The major attack can quickly cause loss of concious.

My condolences to his family, friends & acquaintances.]

Are you sure ? As the heart rate from the restriction is what would cause the heart to attack as to say. That would cause him to grab for his chest because it would be a heart attack. The fact of weight I do not think is the question it is more the fact that the seal may even be tighter. Healthy fat guys are just that healthy fat guys just like healthy skinnys are. Also we have no idea as to how many times he may have had indigestion ? I still wonder about the restriction of the neck seal.
If anybody feels this is disrespect full please do say so.

Cheers
Derek

 

[wedivebc]

This could be a problem. Iam looking into wether or not we have had an increase in heart attacks since latex seals have been main stream ?

Just a thought. Again my heart goes out to the family.
Derek

I am not a doctor but my understanding is a heart attack is caused my a disruption of blood flow to a portion of the heart causing tissue damage. It seems unlikely a cortid sinus reflex or, more importantly latex seals have anything to do with it.

 

[lostinspace]

Are you sure ? As the heart rate from the restriction is what would cause the heart to attack as to say. That would cause him to grab for his chest because it would be a heart attack. The fact of weight I do not think is the question it is more the fact that the seal may even be tighter. Healthy fat guys are just that healthy fat guys just like healthy skinnys are. Also we have no idea as to how many times he may have had indigestion ? I still wonder about the restriction of the neck seal.
If anybody feels this is disrespect full please do say so.

Derek,
of course I'm not sure. I'm not a doctor doing the post-mortem. I wasn't saying he had indigestion, I was trying to say that the early signs of a major heart attack are often ignored, denied and put down to something else. The neck seal issue is more likely to cause a person to lose conciousness first rather than have a heart attack first.

The following comment is no reflection on the victim or anyone else, it is my opinion on a general matter:
there is no such thing as a "healthy fat guy". If you are "fat" or "overweight" it will cause you additional medical complications in your life.

 

[wolf eel]

[wedivebc I am not a doctor but my understanding is a heart attack is caused my a disruption of blood flow to a portion of the heart causing tissue damage. It seems unlikely a cortid sinus reflex or, more importantly latex seals have anything to do with it.]

I should not have said latex. I guess what I mean is the tightness around the throat it causes the heart to pound faster yes it does. It gives your brain the idea it is starving of air (blood) so it triggers the heart to pump faster. I was told. As latex are tighter then tuck that is the only reason I said anything about latex.
I think there may be more reasons then you think as to why the heart may act that way. The point for me is only that the trigger may be the restriction of the throat. that may cause the damage as I have heard of this before.

Cheers
Derek

 

[MikeFerrara]

I guess what I mean is the tightness around the throat it causes the heart to pound faster yes it does. It gives your brain the idea it is starving of air (blood) so it triggers the heart to pump faster.
Cheers
Derek

Hi Derek,

This isn't correct. When something is too tight around the neck it causes the corotid sinus recepters to percieve it as an increase in blood pressure. The bodies normal response is to try to lower it by reducing heart rate...further reducing blood flow to the brain. The concern with a dry suit neck seal or something that is too tight is that the reduced blood flow to the brain (by the restrictive seal and the reduced heart rate) may cause the diver to pass out.

 

[Rick Murchison]

There are several possibilities as to the actual problem in this accident. If the description of the diver's actions is accurate, a carotid reflex problem from a too-tight neck seal ain't one of 'em.
Rick

 

[wolf eel]

[

There are several possibilities as to the actual problem in this accident. If the description of the diver's actions is accurate, a carotid reflex problem from a too-tight neck seal ain't one of 'em.
Rick

]

Are you all sure.

I was talking with a cardio Doc about it and are you sure carotid reflex is the only reflex ? As the doctor put it is one of many. He is still out on this as there are many actions the body does. I am not a doctor he is.
I ask others who know more then me. One of the issues I do not talk about is how my brother passed on and this is apart of it so Rick we had several hundred pages of Doctors reports and they seem to differ from what you are saying.
Derek

 

[wolf eel]

[wolf eel
One of the issues I do not talk about is how my brother passed on and this is apart of it so Rick we had several hundred pages of Doctors reports and they seem to differ from what you are saying.
Derek]

That statment was not to stop the thread. I just try my best to avoid how I have obtained certain data. As people end up feeling bad instead of reflecting on what is being said and contuining the conversation. I have dealt with it. But there is still the how when where and WHY.

That is twelve years old now but the fact remains restriction of the throat can cause all kinds of stress on the heart in many different ways. Stress to the heart cause's heart attacks it's just so easy just to say another person died heart attack thats it. But what caused it is my point. Many healthy divers have heart attacks just like the unhealthy one's.

Cheers
Derek

 

[Snowbear]

Wolf Eel - sounds like you want the same answer about what caused the "heart failure" just like we want to know what really happened when the M.E. calls any water death "drowning."

Even with someone there to see the events unfold, and accurately tells what happened, we will likely never know what truly happened. Everything here is just speculation.

 

[lostinspace]

Are you all sure.

no, and no-one has said they are certain

I was talking with a cardio Doc about it and are you sure carotid reflex is the only reflex ?

no, and no-one has said it is the only reflex

As the doctor put it is one of many. He is still out on this as there are many actions the body does.

yes, that's true.

what more do you want people to say?