Diver Death in Cuba

[flots am]

CO analyzers have been out for a while now, folks need to use them to check tanks, scuba organizations should approach CO testing just like O2 testing...doing it for every fill. I can't believe that the expense of a CO tester would preclude folks like padi implementing it in their programs.
I've only found one tank that exceeds CO levels while diving in mexico. I drained the tank and used another and reported it to the fill station. Testing EVERY tank is worth the time and expense.

PADI doesn't fill tanks, certify compressors, conduct classes or run dive operations. They print books and c-cards and run online training.

Anything else is the responsibility of "someone else" (diver, dive shop, diver, dive boat, etc.).

flots.

 

[DandyDon]

5 divers and 5 headaches? Yeah, that would do it.

I had stopped bringing my CO monitor on dive trips because it always read within limits, but I guess you really can't trust anybody where you don't know the fill station.

Looks like I'll need to start packing it again.

flots.

I know the feeling. It gets boring testing tank after tank with no results, and if you're the only one on the boat who even bothers - you wonder. Some estimates suggest that 97% of fills are safe. Sometimes it takes a while to fun across some of the 3% unsafe, but still - better to test before a hit than after, if even possible. I was the dork who checked every day until the day I was the hero for busting all tanks over 10 ppm on the way to a deep dive.

Hi mdax. This was an Introduction course. People who have never been diving before surely can't be expected to carry CO analyzers.
PADI does not regulate courses in Cuba and it was not a PADI course.

True & true. It'd still be nice if more experienced divers helped ferret out the problems by testing all tanks and pushing for inline analyzers with auto shut off, and it'd be nice if Padi would teach more than sniff & taste.

 

[sweir]

I know the feeling. It gets boring testing tank after tank with no results, and if you're the only one on the boat who even bothers - you wonder. Some estimates suggest that 97% of fills are safe. Sometimes it takes a while to fun across some of the 3% unsafe, but still - better to test before a hit than after, if even possible. I was the dork who checked every day until the day I was the hero for busting all tanks over 10 ppm on the way to a deep dive.


True & true. It'd still be nice if more experienced divers helped ferret out the problems by testing all tanks and pushing for inline analyzers with auto shut off, and it'd be nice if Padi would teach more than sniff & taste.

When you are dealing with resort courses and walk-up recreational dive charters, the gear providers must be responsible for checking their rental equipment. On many dives I have been on, you don't see the tank you are going to dive with until it is almost time to hit the water. Would suggest that dive operators should also have available testers in shops and on dive boats. Not sure how trustworthy a strangers tester might be (but it is way better than nothing). Never had a bad fill but have had a few no fills and a few wonky Nitrox fills (they said 30 my tester said 32).

 

[DandyDon]

When you are dealing with resort courses and walk-up recreational dive charters, the gear providers must be responsible for checking their rental equipment. On many dives I have been on, you don't see the tank you are going to dive with until it is almost time to hit the water. Would suggest that dive operators should also have available testers in shops and on dive boats. Not sure how trustworthy a strangers tester might be (but it is way better than nothing). Never had a bad fill but have had a few no fills and a few wonky Nitrox fills (they said 30 my tester said 32).

Eh, I bought an O2 analyzer after using the shop's unit on my first Nitrox trip. Hated theirs. And I've seen times that the shop just failed to have an O2 analyzer handy even after promising.

As far as CO testing: The sport developed by taking risks before this technology was available so the veterans are slow to adopt it, but now we have it - use it. If you don't want to own a tank analyzer, you can rent one for a trip. See my sig for link.

 

[Ayisha]

When you are dealing with resort courses and walk-up recreational dive charters, the gear providers must be responsible for checking their rental equipment. On many dives I have been on, you don't see the tank you are going to dive with until it is almost time to hit the water. Would suggest that dive operators should also have available testers in shops and on dive boats. Not sure how trustworthy a strangers tester might be (but it is way better than nothing). Never had a bad fill but have had a few no fills and a few wonky Nitrox fills (they said 30 my tester said 32).

I think the onus should always be on the air fill seller/provider to provide air that sustains life. We are buying a product, which is the gas, and/or renting the equipment, and it needs to be in working order and not in a condition which will harm us.

We are getting into a dangerous territory now where testing your own air is being advocated, but it is still a rare occurrence. The legal implications for responsibility will get more and more blurred as hand-held units become more common.

BTW, Stephen, a few years ago in Tobermory, I tested my EANx fill which was supposed to be 28% for the Forest City and it was - 39%. The kid that filled it even told me a couple of times that I didn't need to bother checking it because his fills were always perfect. I checked it anyway and he and I were shocked at the result. I then informed his boss since he had tried to pressure me into not even checking.

 

[flots am]

I think the onus should always be on the air fill seller/provider to provide air that sustains life. We are buying a product, which is the gas, and/or renting the equipment, and it needs to be in working order and not in a condition which will harm us.

We are getting into a dangerous territory now where testing your own air is being advocated, but it is still a rare occurrence. The legal implications for responsibility will get more and more blurred as hand-held units become more common.

Unfortunately this isn't a situation where you get a second chance if the tank fill place screws up. It's nice that they're "responsible" but dead is dead.

BTW, Stephen, a few years ago in Tobermory, I tested my EANx fill which was supposed to be 28% for the Forest City and it was - 39%. The kid that filled it even told me a couple of times that I didn't need to bother checking it because his fills were always perfect. I checked it anyway and he and I were shocked at the result. I then informed his boss since he had tried to pressure me into not even checking.

You too? Was it the place right across from the dock (if you drove your boat straight up out of the water, you'd be in front of the shop?)

I dropped my tanks off for some 32, and when I picked them up, the girl said "You have to watch as I analyze them." then hooked up the analyzer and cranked the zero-adjust until it said "32", then turned to me and said "There you go, 32%"

I started to explain that she was supposed to calibrate the analyzer against air first,, then check the tank, but she got all pissy and walked away. I talked to the guy behind the counter who wasn't interested. Finally I said "screw it" and tossed the tanks in the car and used a spares I had brought. Now I own my own analyzer.

It's sad that divers have to buy this stuff, but I've only seen one fill station that had an inline CO analyzer, and it's one of the only places that I don't think would ever have a problem. The equipment looks like it's ready to put in an operating room. All clean and shiny and perfect. The scary places never have one.

flots.

 

[Ayisha]

No, not that place. There aren't too many in Toby though...

Inline CO monitors are becoming more common in Ontario because some Ministry of Labour inspectors have been demanding them of the dive shops. However, they don't necessarily have automatic shut-offs, may not always be plugged in, and someone may not always be close enough to hear the alarms, so their presence isn't fool-proof. It would be nice if the shops had CO analyzers just like O2 analyzers. However, none of this is the case in Cuba...

 

[DandyDon]

As much as I have seen ignored and go wrong, even if I saw my tank filled with an inline CO monitor in place, I'd still test the tank with my portable CO tester.

With all the wealth & technology of the US, only this week did people start learning that 48 states do not require CO alarms in schools. Smoke alarms are no brainers, but I guess fires get more attention than "The Silent Killer," as I see the risk ignored so much everywhere! 43 students, 10 adults suffer carbon monoxide poisoning at Atlanta elementary school - U.S. News