Dive Rite rebreather - Ginnie Springs

[caveseeker7]

New pin system to activate/deactivate unit

pin to activate helium

locking out most of the diagnostics screen (the HH was for advanced user, the DR is for everyday divers they dont want potential screw ups)

adding a few other tweeks (some I have been requesting for a LONG time)but without some else paying the bills it wasn;t a high priority

Do HammerHeads for Inspo, MK-series and KISS all get those same changes?

HH for inspiration is ready to go including the solenoid (the only thing NOT included is the LID o-ring (take it from your old lid or get one from SDS)

How about HH for MK-series (or is it called HammerPod)?
Was the price the same?

 

[padiscubapro]

Do HammerHeads for Inspo, MK-series and KISS all get those same changes?


How about HH for MK-series (or is it called HammerPod)?
Was the price the same?

All the changes should be carried across the board the only difference is probably the PIN system. Kevin does not want to maintain different sets of hardware/software so all updates are carried across the board (this is also why he offers upgrades to new hardware at a reasonable cost).. Units for other RBS are generally cheaper since the only come with handsets, cables and solenoid.. they have tobe plumbed into what ever unit its for (the exception was the kiss classic which Kevin had gordon make some kidney's)

The prices vary.. The Inps HH was the most expensive.. That head is made out of a big block of UHMW (UV stabilized version) - big $$ then the machine cost which also isn't cheap since it has to be machined at a slow speed...

 

[JonnyB]

One thing tha confuses me is the lack of pictures and the pictures that do exist differ from each other quite alot, then the fact the the dive rite rebreather is not connected to the dive rite page, but to another. The pictures you presented here in this thread are similar the the oned from the DEMA show last year, i think it looks really ugly and i would never want to have the scrubber where it is, that is just my opinion, But the diverite express who is trying to sell the unit does not have any pictures of it, other that that of a case, which is too small to see anything. How do they expect to sell?

/Jonny

 

[caveseeker7]

One thing tha confuses me is the lack of pictures and the pictures that do exist differ from each other quite a lot

That's because they are all prototypes. AFAIK DiveRite (or whoever builds them) build ten of them, some of which went to handfull of people for testing and feedback. Most I gather were IANTD instructors, which is why IANTD already has a bunch of instructors for the rigs while they are still prototypes.

The red winged rig has a different frame from the one shown at DEMA, but it still has the old Hammerhead handsets. The production units will have the new metal handsets.

i think it looks really ugly and i would never want to have the scrubber where it is

Well, it's a testing protoype, so I won't judge the looks quite yet.
But I certainly wouldn't want that scrubber there.

then the fact the the dive rite rebreather is not connected to the dive rite page, but to another.

I find that odd, too.

But the diverite express who is trying to sell the unit does not have any pictures of it, other that that of a case, which is too small to see anything.

Probably because the scrubber is a prototype, too. The description on the page said it will be dark red.

How do they expect to sell?

My guess, by the reputation of Juergensen's Hammerhead and the people who test dive it. Tom Mount, Joe Dituri et al have a pretty good reputation, so when they promote the rig people listen.

That's how the Meg got it's start, too. "Tom Mount dives his Meg almost exclusively when caving." "Tom Mount and Mark Meadows dove their Megs to 500 something feet." That was topped when several of the Cis-Lunar divers added Megs to their dive lockers or, like Tom Mount, replaced them entirely.

Problem is, the Meg is a much more versatile CCR. Different sized tanks, scrubber, choice of electronics, all beautifully build. And very solid.

The O2ptima (even the name sucks) has the HH going for it, and maybe the DiveRite BCD choices, but that's about it. Whatever the HH adds, the Micropore scrubber subtracts, at least in my opinion. Depth limit 50 meters? On a $7,500 rebreather with trimix deco computer? Tested at 1 ata? It weights in like a MK15.5! Has big tanks. Try to travel with those jugs.

No matter how much they praise that unit, I doubt they'll be trading in their Megs and Cis-Lunars for it. But the sad thing is, it might just work.

 

[musmach]

the Micropore scrubber subtracts, at least in my opinion. Depth limit 50 meters? On a $7,500 rebreather with trimix deco computer? Tested at 1 ata? It weights in like a MK15.5! Has big tanks. Try to travel with those jugs.

From what I saw, I do not think the scrubber was made by Micropore. I beleive they are custom made to fit the extendair cartridge by Farallon.

 

[caveseeker7]

From what I saw, I do not think the scrubber was made by Micropore. I beleive they are custom made to fit the extendair cartridge by Farallon.

It could well be that the cannister is manufactured by Farallon since it contains the sensors as well as the solenoid. Another possibilty is that only the "end cap" on the left hand side (when viewed from behind) is made by Farallon and assembled there with Micropore parts. The lid of the cannister looks the same as the ones for Dolphin and Azi, same bayonett lock. The cartridges are definitely Micropore's.

 

[Wayne A]

It could well be that the cannister is manufactured by Farallon since it contains the sensors as well as the solenoid. Another possibilty is that only the "end cap" on the left hand side (when viewed from behind) is made by Farallon and assembled there with Micropore parts. The lid of the cannister looks the same as the ones for Dolphin and Azi, same bayonett lock. The cartridges are definitely Micropore's.

From their website (farallonusa.com) :

Farallon USA Inc. Announces New Rebreather "Optima"




Farallon USA Inc. announces the introduction of latest rebreather product. Optima, a result of a joint ventures between Farallon and Dive Rite will be available summer 2005.

The beta tests by some of the leading names in the dive industry are continuing to ensure zero tolerance failure, and optimum performance.

“Prior to research and development of Optima, we took a good look at what is in the market, thus Optima will be an upgrade choice to what is in the market today” said Rudi Asseer, President of FarallonUSA. Gone are the days of custom tools to assemble your rebreather.

Farallon has used its military experience to deliver a state of the art rebreather. The Optima has been designed to use standard tools for assembly, standard hose fittings throughout the unit, and even standard 11” center holes for the harness and bladder allowing the user to easily customize his unit.

 

[caveseeker7]

Thanks Wayne, that was good for a loud laugh.

The beta tests by some of the leading names in the dive industry are continuing to ensure zero tolerance failure, and optimum performance.

See, there's the marketing and the testing.

“Prior to research and development of Optima, we took a good look at what is in the market, thus Optima will be an upgrade choice to what is in the market today”

In which market I wonder, the local supermarket?
Appearantly a market without a 47 lbs rig that lasts 5 hours under rigid condition, one that doesn't include a decades old annular axial scrubber design, one that doesn't include such niceties as fully recoverable loop, self-draining counterlungs, manual drains in both counterlungs, isolation for automatic gas addition, offboard gas switchblocks, physical power disconnect, or the ability to monitor the rebreather without power. Much less DSVs with integrated bailout or HUD with deco information.

Yes, the O2ptima is the mother of all upgrades. Now I can see the "leading names in the dive industry" retiring their Megalodons and Cis-Lunar. Finally the "state of the art rebreather" has arrived!

Farallon has used its military experience to deliver a state of the art rebreather.

Yes, even the US NAVY will take one look at Micropore's testing data and the feedback from the "leading names in the dive industry" and sell off their MK16 and LAR V fleets and mothball the odd Viper and PRISM. About time they move into the 21st century and get a "state of the art rebreather".

And thanks to the extensive testing regimen not only will any further testing be unnecessary, they might as well shut CSS down and let two handfull of IANTD instructors do their work ... who needs engineers anyway. Deep in my heart I always knew IANTD stood for International Association of Navy Test Divers.

 

[Wayne A]

Humour is the best medicine.

I'm actually surprised that it got into production so fast given the debacle with the arrow that DR were almost 2 years late to market with (also made by farallon). Given the different configs on the test rigs, is there complete clarity on what will be delivered? I haven't really been following the optima issue but I seem to recall over on www.rebreatherworld.com that there were concerns that no-one had actually seen the final production unit ( could be wrong though).

Thanks Wayne, that was good for a loud laugh.

See, there's the marketing and the testing.


In which market I wonder, the local supermarket?
Appearantly a market without a 47 lbs rig that lasts 5 hours under rigid condition, one that doesn't include a decades old annular axial scrubber design, one that doesn't include such niceties as fully recoverable loop, self-draining counterlungs, manual drains in both counterlungs, isolation for automatic gas addition, offboard gas switchblocks, physical power disconnect, or the ability to monitor the rebreather without power. Much less DSVs with integrated bailout or HUD with deco information.

Yes, the O2ptima is the mother of all upgrades. Now I can see the "leading names in the dive industry" retiring their Megalodons and Cis-Lunar. Finally the "state of the art rebreather" has arrived!


Yes, even the US NAVY will take one look at Micropore's testing data and the feedback from the "leading names in the dive industry" and sell off their MK16 and LAR V fleets and mothball the odd Viper and PRISM. About time they move into the 21st century and get a "state of the art rebreather".

And thanks to the extensive testing regimen not only will any further testing be unnecessary, they might as well shut CSS down and let two handfull of IANTD instructors do their work ... who needs engineers anyway. Deep in my heart I always knew IANTD stood for International Association of Navy Test Divers.

 

[caveseeker7]

I'm actually surprised that it got into production so fast given the debacle with the arrow that DR were almost 2 years late to market with.

That's the advantage of using existing products, even they need to be modified.
The Hammerhead was sorted out, but software got the PIN# and optional trimix (rather than stock trimix), hardware will get all new metal handsets.

Scrubber was either modified with a new end cap, or is a new one, but the size specs for the cartridge and Dolphin/Azi cannister are known so even that would be fairly easy to achieve.

Don't know if Micropore does the actual cannister production and assembly, but Juergensen builds the HH. Farming out some of the production/sub assembly eases production setup.

... I seem to recall over on www.rebreatherworld.com that there were concerns that no-one had actually seen the final production unit.

I doubt anyone outside DiveRite/Farallon/Juergensen has as the new handsets aren't delivered yet afaik.