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If you're going to moderate and edit post at least make it clear you have edited them so people will know that is ISNT a post entirely by the user?

I disagree with draconian moderation that allows a certain user to continually post ill-informed opinion unchecked whilst removing ALL the posts that ask him to back up his claims or provide evidence for them. Thereby allowing a user to post potentially dangerous or at best completely misleading posts with no come-back at all.
 
If you're going to moderate and edit post at least make it clear you have edited them so people will know that is ISNT a post entirely by the user?

I disagree with draconian moderation that allows a certain user to continually post ill-informed opinion unchecked whilst removing ALL the posts that ask him to back up his claims or provide evidence for them. Thereby allowing a user to post potentially dangerous or at best completely misleading posts with no come-back at all.

If you keep it up...NetDoc will just impose a Ignore on you and let the misinformation continue even easier. An Unfortunate fact.
 
We have plenty of comebacks. We can refute the information, and provide better information, as DAA just did.

I'm with you; I get very frustrated trying to correct misinformation again and again. Unfortunately, it is the nature of internet BBs, that everyone has the right to post their misconceptions, and it is caveat emptor for the reader.

We may all say "So-and-so's information is incorrect." We may not say, "So and so is an idiot," or, "Get out of here, so-and-so, because you don't know what you are talking about."
 
If you're going to moderate and edit post at least make it clear you have edited them so people will know that is ISNT a post entirely by the user?

I disagree with draconian moderation that allows a certain user to continually post ill-informed opinion unchecked whilst removing ALL the posts that ask him to back up his claims or provide evidence for them. Thereby allowing a user to post potentially dangerous or at best completely misleading posts with no come-back at all.

I don't normally do this, but its your call regarding airing this difference of opinion in the thread rather than in a pm, so here's my position.

The edits are noted in the post and they are also noted in the footer explaining the reason for the edit. I only cut the inflamatory material, I added nothing so everything that is left is posted by the user. If the user re-edits, it will show in the footer.

Lets also look at the issue from the OP's perspective - he started the thread and he owns it. He asked a simple question and two members started going at with personal insults based on opinions and biases that started well outside of and well before this thread. That is not anything I consider to be on topic. He then posts to that effect, and then feels the need to aplogize for causing a controversy. He has no need to aplogize and he did not deserve the responses he got. At that point moderation is both warranted and overdue.

What a wonderful way to welcome people to the tech forum. Please try to remember that as a technical diver, your actions reflect on the rest of us who are represented in and by this forum.

As for the specific stuff remaining in the edited posts that you feel may be dangerous or misleading absent a more enlightened response:

1. Get V-planner.
2. Gear choice is personal and should not be infringed.
3. A tongue in cheek comment about methods of propulsion being defined as scooter use.

None of the three are things a reasonable person would construe as being unsafe in and of themselves. The third is a bit sarcastic but the smiley emoticon does suggest humous intent. I let it live. It is my call as the draconian moderator to do that.

The "GUE always trying to sell halcyon" comment was perhaps misleading, but it was addressed by another member without getting personal. I'll address it further to ensure no one is misled:

Personally, I can see where some people may feel that way and a trip through downtown High Springs can tend to lead you to make a similar connection between GUE and Halcyon. The principle characters in both are historically somewhat intertwined. However oo be fair, I have seen instructors who push OMS or Dive Rite products just as adamantly in their classes so it really is an instructor issue not an agency or company issue.

In the future, please feel free to address anything that you feel may be unsafe or misleading, but please do so in a manner that does not insult others, respects the rights of others to express their opinions, respects the reality that opinions will differ and that there is room for a fairly wide variety of opinion in the technical diving community. If you don't agree with that, consider hanging out in the DIR forum where the range of acceptable opinion is by design more narrowly focused and more defined to avoid these types of disagreements.

Generally refuting an opinion that you feel is dangerous or misleading is most effectively done by posting your opinion and supporting evidence rather than challenging others to defend their statement(s) and perhaps questionable rationale. When you just challenge someone, especially someone with weak credentials, you are effectively handing them control of the argument. When that occurs, you are just feeding into their desire to argue or create controversy and you allow the other party to continue stating comments, opinion and perhaps defamatory remarks with no real obligation to support their case. When that happens moderation is virtually inevitable as a person with no real case when challenged directly will almost always respond with a character assasination to try to discredit their challenger or at least draw them away from a logical argument. If you bite on that, they win everytime.

You need to own your responsibility for what happens in a thread. In a real sense, you have a great deal of control over the eventual need for moderation even when you are not the offending party by choosing your approach carefully and not creating the opportunity for them to take pot shots.

Like our mama's all told us, - it takes two to fight.
 
Personally, I find the TDI materials to be quite lacking. The IANTD material is in my experience much more complete. However, the IANTD texts have horrible editing, so pick your poison there.

I agree with UCF regarding helium. If you're going to be doing deep dives, best be clearheaded about it. Note I'm not talking "full trimix," but rather a course that will get you access to normoxic gases like 21/35 which would be perfect for your immediate goals.

Look at combining classes (e.g. rec trimix + advanced nitrox + deco).

That said, I agree that an intro class to get you solid in the new gear configuration and with the new mindset is likely warranted first.
 
While I don't think that narcotic depths >100ft are necessarily suicidal, not using all the tools available nowadays to have a more well rounded and enjoyable dive seems foolish.

Hence I would recommend curricula which introduce helium relatively early, like NAUI Tech, GUE, and some others depending on the package/instructor.

Historically TDI and nowadays DSAT in particular are generally discouraging of helium in the 100-150ft range and less desirable to me.

Many agencies have an "intro to tech" like weekend dealio and I would start there, with an instructor you know. Ask you local buddies for recommendations.
 
Hello All

I was looking for a little guidance on which way i should go with my training. I was interested in diving doubles go a little deeper than the 130 and some decompression dives. I have my AOW and Nitrox certifications and I took the Nitrox through TDI and felt it was a good curriculum so staying with TDI, i was looking at combining either there intro to tech with decompression class or the advanced nitrox and the decompression class. any help on the agency, classes and south Fl location would be a big help. thanks in advance for your input

jrock1062, a few months ago I was in exactly the same boat you are about where to take my training. My ultimate goal is penetration wreck diving. I visited a few "tech oriented" LDS's throughout Florida and got different "pitches" from different folks depending mostly upon the agency that they were associated with or what gear they sold. They made me feel like a real "newbie" and like I was imposing on them.

In a LDS in Miami, I picked up GUE's "Fundamentals" book. I liked what I read about GUE's approach to diving and their gear configuration. I was mostly intrigued about the "why" gear was configured in a particular manner. I returned to that shop with a list of questions and they took the time to explain EVERYTHING they could. However, what I liked most about that visit was the shop's willingness to help and the experience that I had. I left there saying "these are the people I want to dive with". Since then, with their help, I've been training for GUE's entry level course (GUE Fundamentals) on bpw (with single and double tanks) and otherwise full "tech" configured gear and I love it. I can't ever imagine going back to a regular "bc", etc. Please note that this was not intended to be a DIR/Halcyon "pitch" but rather sharing my recent experience.

All that to say that I would go with an Agency/LDS/Instructor that you are VERY comfortable with. Your life may depend on it!

Good luck.
;)
 
Personally, I find the TDI materials to be quite lacking. The IANTD material is in my experience much more complete. However, the IANTD texts

There was rumour they were being rewritten but ive not heard any more about it. Certainly my TDI materials are lacking. All have the appearance of low quality copies and not really detailed at all. The courses themselves are excellent but im not impressed by the written material backing it up.
 

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