Depth: 95 ft, In Deco, 500 psi, No Buddy

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You are correct not everyone, but there are some who do

What is more important is are you aware of how tbone came up with those numbers and do you subscribe to his methodology. Don't just listen to these threads and regurgitate - understand them and see if they apply to your diving style... If they do - great - If they don't adjust and adapt - not every pearl of wisdom on this board is a gem... You need to decide for yourself which is gem and which is fool's gold...

Happy diving... :)
 
I have been holding this post for an hour, and I still think it is worth saying:

If this thread was started by someone very few people knew, had maybe 50 dives, and was lobstering, how many would be saying " good job staying calm" and would instead be saying "why did you purposely stretch the limits of your gas and your NDL??" ...//...
Valid concern, but this is one of the last voices from the fringe.

[Opinion] ScubaBoard is ever becoming a more fuzzy, warm, and quiet place. [/Opinion]

The spice is constantly culled, VooDooGasMan, MissDirected, Jax, on and on...

Yes, you are right. It was totally irresponsible behavior. It should not have been posted.
 
Some are bothered because this runs against dogma. (Speaking of which, I can already see a pony bottle size argument brewing here.)

But DD makes clear that this is not SOP, nor is it recommended. Having said that, I found it to be a resourceful response to a "What If" scenario. Especially I found the "floating relaxed ascent" interesting and, in this case, useful.
 
What to do in this type of situation?

On a recent lobster dive I happened to capture my computer readings and gas pressure readings for the end of my dive. I pushed the no-deco limits to catch a lobster, wound the “clock” down to ZERO minutes leaving me ZERO No Deco Time. Then, as soon as I started my ascent, the computer kicked me into a REQUIRED Decompression Dive.

My gas pressure at this time is about 500 psi (in a 108 cu-ft, steel tank).

Certainly it is NOT recommended or safe for recreational divers to push the limits or go into deco and they probably should be saving more air for the ascent as well. Many people are taught the simplistic rule of: be on the boat with 500 psi – which may be inadequate.

The reason I made a video of the ascent is to demonstrate that this is NOT the time to panic or get really worried, or rush your ascent, or kick up hard or begin to breathe fast or get overly stressed out.

We have many examples of divers who have never seen their computer in deco and once it happens they kinda freak out and rush to the surface – breathing like a freight train. Sometimes I think they feel their goal is to get on the boat with as close to 500 psi as possible – so the faster they rush to the surface the less “trouble they are going to be in”. This is NOT the way to handle such a situation. (Most instructors would say that the best way to handle this situation is to avoid it, but that is not the point).

This video demonstrates what I do (or did on this occasion) in this situation. Keep in mind that the deco penalty is as small as it can be (only one minute), but many people would be very concerned by “being in true DECO” and also having just 500 psi at around 100 ft depth.

Instead of exerting myself, you can hear me pop the inflator and get just slightly buoyant so I can drift slowly upward with zero kicking. I slow my breathing and RELAX. I go up SLOW, I check my depth frequently and carefully monitor my ascent rate.

This video is in real time (except for the pauses during the console reading). By the time I reach a depth of about 44 ft (I think it is) – Wow.. my deco penalty is gone - and I have many minutes of no deco time back on my computer.

This is not surprising to a good percentage of experienced divers.. come up a little slower than the maximum ascent rate, relax and your deco time will “clear itself” before you even get close to the decompression ceiling depth. For them, the video will be trivial and boring (maybe that is the point of the video).

My objective in posting this is NOT to advocate or recommend that any recreational diver put themselves in deco and they certainly should preserve a safe volume of gas for their ascent (and enough to share with a buddy). My goal is to provide a simple example that if you (unintentionally) go a little into deco, it is possible to make an ascent using a modest amount of gas, do it reasonably safely and this is NOT THE TIME TO RUSH TO THE SURFACE.

For this dive, I was alone – so I had no need to reserve air for a buddy, I had an independent bail out bottle (a pony bottle) as a back up and I was not diving in an aggressive or reckless manner. I continued a slow ascent and completed an additional safety stop on this dive (as I do on almost every dive) and exited the water with a few hundred psi remaining (and a full pony bottle).

Making an ascent from this depth while sharing air with a panicked buddy and having to exert yourself would result in air consumption rates that would be 5 or 10 times higher than shown in this video, so please don’t interpret this as a suggestion that people should be starting their ascents from 100 ft with 500 psi! The objective is to show what it might look like if you over-stay “your welcome” for a few moments and how it might be handled – even if you have not reserved a whole lot of air.

Since the intended audience is inexperienced recreational divers, it is also very important to remind them that if they continue to remain at depth (once the computer kicks into deco), the penalties (i.e., true deco time) will accrue quickly and a 1 minute deco stop can turn into a 5 or 10 minute stop faster than you can catch a lobster… Especially if you are silly enough to do this on the 3rd dive of the day. This can be a serious or life threatening situation if you don’t have the gas and skills to deal with decompression.

Maybe others will find the topic useful?


Good teachable moment and thanks for sharing.

The other thing to mention is 500 PSI can last you quite a long time if needed. In a Al80 I can spin out 500 PSI for over 16 minutes at 15 feet with only moderate skip breathing. You don't mention whether your steel tank was LP or HP, but in either case with a 108 you have plenty of time to make your way to an appropriate depth and complete a short deco stop with plenty left over for your 3 minute safety cushion.

On the other hand, panicking and rapidly increasing your breathing is just going to create a whole lot of problems.
 
The spice is constantly culled, VooDooGasMan, MissDirected, Jax, on and on...

@lowviz you kill me with these.. accurate as they are. Maybe someday I will use that quote and add in lowviz.

Ok, back to the thread topic. It sure made me do a lot of research running rockbottom.xls and checking the psi to cu/ft on a LP108. Obviously it is better if we never exceed our NDL, but it does happen to some of us (I guess) err.. I know..

DD made a very controlled ascent certainly lower than 30 ft/min and probably used around 6-7 cu/ft to get to the surface. I wish he had left that camera on all the way to the surface.

Yes, I think an example of a direct ascent from 100 ish on an AL80 starting at 1000psi would be more beneficial to new divers who are planning to start diving those depths. But we have what we have and IMHO DD was well within (HIS) safety limits.
 
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...//.. Someday I will use that quote and add in lowviz. ...
Ha!

Yes, most likely so. :(

One can dance on razor wire for only so long. Anyway, you obviously got my intended mild sarcasm. :) I'm better now...

...//..Ok, back to the thread topic. It sure made me do a lot of research r
Yes, and that is the true value of such people and posts...
 
@lowviz I was editing my post as my laptop likes to give me a rash of crap and delete things I think are important. I hope you continue to keep your wit.. I for one enjoy it.. and agree with it..
 
...The general consensus appears to be "don't use the pony in your gas planning, use it as a redundant air source...

...I just think that this post and the responses is quite contradictory on may levels and does not assist the newish diver...

I don't think DD's gas planning included his pony, I believe it was for the intended purpose

I don't think this post is really for the "newish" diver except for the "don't panic" part. This was a solo dive with a redundant air source to 100 feet, not exactly the newish diver thing.

I doubt if you will find many who would say a 40 is a bare minimum for a pony. Many will say why not a 30 or a 40. (I do know of at least one dive boat that will not allow a pony larger than a 30.) I suspect the majority will say that a 19 is adequate.

This is correct, the pony size issue has been debated many, many times. Personal calculations are easy to make regarding what kind of gas volume is required. My pony is for emergencies, not for deco. For me,19 cf is more than adequate for any solo recreational dive.
 
What he said was -

Meaning - I saw divers racing past us on the mooring line - not Experienced Divers Racing Past Us... :)

I stand corrected... reading it diagonally during work.... but still even tho rhwestfall experienced divers behaving like this, they are obviously not experienced divers :cheers:
 

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