Deconcentration of Attention / Altered States diving

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More like it benefitted me as a person in general.

Two memorable things:
I had my ribs cracked by a slight woman with impeccable style. She did a 'fake' I fell for it and rushed her. The safey zone of her kick was gone. I dropped like a wet rag. It validated the sport for me. We became friends and was often kidded about who could 'take me out'.

In the dressing room, a lower belt accidentally bumped me. He looked in horror and said "Sorry". I said: "I've taken worse". We all had a good laugh.

My instructor taught peace.
 
I like that: “a slight woman with impeccable style” My young nieces are studying a martial art, I think jujitsu, maybe karate. Since they will soon be teenagers I’m relieved they will have some self defense skills!
 
aquacat8:
I’m interested in how normal people can experience beneficial altered states similar to meditation from being in the water:
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You've seen me dive. I go into a complete Zen. I relax to the point that I feel, hear, and see almost everything around me.
 
rhwestfall:
When I first saw the title, all I could think of is the young hung over Florida DM's I've encountered.....
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Wait.. I thought all dm's were hung over? No?

There goes that dream.. thanks for ruining it for me.
 
Some of us just bliss out in the water, others don’t seem to get that effect. I wonder if that has anything to do with who sticks with diving after trying. Some people get bored if they’re not seeing sharks and eagle rays, others like @The Chairman seem perfectly content hanging out in a dark corner of a cavern, without even a flashlight on, LOL.
 
That is interesting, and may explain some of the good feeling from diving. But swim bliss occurs in very shallow water. Maybe that is more related to endorphins from exercise, and the full body massage of water, and the joy of the flying-like freedom of movement in three dimensional space, and feeling free of excess gravity. Then if you descend... more body/brain stuff happens.

I read some more of the psychonetics article and it sounds scary, dangerous and nutty. But we don’t need psychonetics to experience the stuff I’m talking about. Just getting immersed is enough.
 
aquacat8:
Some of us just bliss out in the water, others don’t seem to get that effect. I wonder if that has anything to do with who sticks with diving after trying. Some people get bored if they’re not seeing sharks and eagle rays, others like @The Chairman seem perfectly content hanging out in a dark corner of a cavern, without even a flashlight on, LOL.
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When I go snorkeling in a pond, maybe not even chest deep, but with lots of submerged vegetation, I feel like I am flying over a forest. I forget that my body is big compared to the "trees"; I feel no bigger than the fishes hiding in the forest "canopy" and "understory."

The same effect happens in shallow saltwater: sand formations below me are "plateaus," "valleys," "cliffs," even if in reality they may be only a few feet of microtopography.

Some of my most mind blowing experiences involved wearing a mask and snorkel, and lying belly-down on a gravel bar in a stream just deep enough to submerge my head. Little minnows come right up to my mask, and I can see their colors so much better than I could looking down from standing height. In those moments, I feel like I am no bigger than my submerged head.
 
lowviz:
But is it possible that this is just another dimension of schizophrenia?
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Had a long family day at the zoo; haven't read the link in detail. I'd be really hesitant to link something to schizophrenia, though. Off the top of my head, a few basics about Schizophrenia:

1.) Many mental illnesses are defined in terms of a syndrome - a minimum number of symptoms, present for a minimum amount of time, impairing one or more domains of function in a clinically significant way, not better explained by another diagnosis. This as opposed to some sort of direct confirmation - you don't get a brain biopsy or blood test and 'confirm' schizophrenia. There are physical signs in many (e.g.: loss of brain matter over time, enlargement of the lateral ventricles in the brain), but not such that you can pop up a brain CT and definitively confirm or refute it.

2.) Schizophrenia affects close to 1 in 100 people. It is NOT multiple personality disorder. One article in a professionally-related e-mailing I got over the years claimed that from a genetics perspective, it might be 8 different disorders (underling etiologies). Onset in men often late teens or early 20's, women a bit later. Family history can drive up risk; I've read about half of identical twins of a schizophrenic have schizophrenia, but then why don't the other half?

3.) It's a mix of positive (e.g.: hallucinations, delusions), negative (e.g.: deficit symptoms, such as very dull or flat emotional display, or apathy) and cognitive (thinking/processing) symptoms. Prognosis is poor; ending up on disability is very common. Often there's a gradual deterioration in baseline function over time.

My point in going into this tangent is, schizophrenia is a biologically rooted severe mental illness, usually persistent through the remainder of life, that damages the brain (particularly early in the course of illness) resulting in abnormalities in the content (e.g.: delusions, hallucinations) and process (e.g.: disorganization) of thought, with a highly variable presentation across individuals. I'm skeptical it's likely to inform our understanding of psychologically healthy diver mental processes.

From the article - "AD leads to “empty” consciousness or, in other words, to cessation of inner dialog – this permits to react more quickly and adequately." Schizophrenics in active psychotic states often hear voices and/or experience delusions (often paranoia), far from a cessation of inner dialog.

I'd be interested to hear what others may think on the subject.

Richard.
 
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