Creation vs. Evolution

[lamont]

Do you know the barrier does not exist of do you refuse to believe that it exists?

no, i require proof of you that it does exist. you claim that there's a barrier there, so show me it.

Have you actually seen the shift into other orders and classes or do you believe it must have occured?

of course i haven't seen it occur with my own eyes. yes, it is extrapolation. extrapolation is actually different than faith and has a pretty decent track record in science. you need to prove that the extrapolation is invalid. i ask a very simple question which is to show me where the barrier occurs.

Your argument is circular: the fossil records show it occured and it occured because fossil records show it occured. Your "science" is faith.

your understanding of a circular argument is poor.

You assume the fossil record is somehow chronoligical despite no direct observation. You also assume your dating methods are infallible. How do you date the fossils? By the age of the rocks? Do you date the rocks by the alleged age of the fossils?

radioisotope dating (which goes well beyond radiocarbon dating) is widely useful. it has been used, for example, to date the age of the moon and to show that the moon was formed by crust material from the earth which was ejected due to an impact and to date the time of the impact. similar techniques can be used to date rocks on earth. those dates are consistant with the age of the Sun calculated from stellar models, which relies on stellar nucleosynthesis and fusion physics rather than radioactive decay models, and thereby validates the range of dates generated from radioisotope studies. and if all the methods of radioisotope dating are wrong you would have pretty much overthrown just about everything we know about nuclear physics.

so, no, i don't assume the dating methods are infallable. and nobody would use fossils to date rocks to date fossils.

Here's another question; statistically, what is the probability of a fully viable human female evolving concurrently to a fully viable human male? "Well it must have happened because ..." is not a scientific answer. And that's only once example of the insanity of your "science".

that's got to be some of the best evidence yet that you don't really understand evolutionary theory at all.

Continue to believe that you are refined primordial soup; it's your choice.

show me the inherant barrier to speciation in evolution. show me the clothes the emperor is wearing.

 

[Bryan]

Mix with n-cans of time.

 

[Thalassamania]

Do you know the barrier does not exist of do you refuse to believe that it exists? Have you actually seen the shift into other orders and classes or do you believe it must have occured? Your argument is circular: the fossil records show it occured and it occured because fossil records show it occured. Your "science" is faith.

No "barrier" exists in the term that you are using the word. Species are not static, unique populations that exist until some defined genetic distance or some certain time has been covered. A species should be seen as a breeding population that is isolated, one way or another, from other breeding populations. I have discussed some of the ways that such isolation can occur in recent posts. Populations can remain separate and go their separate ways, eventually they will be so different that it may be had to tell, at first glance, that they are related, or they can come back together and hybridize to a new species damn near instantly or simple mix back together and produce a more variable gene pool with some new options for the entire population to head off in a new direction.

Now I took that time to read the bible and to study a number of philosophies and to study comparative religion and to read history (from many perspectives) before I rejected religion as a steaming pile of bantha poo-do. But do you really expect to waltz into this conversation, as a biological ignoramus, and be taken seriously? If you understood what we were talking about, and then chose to reject it on its merits, because you found something more reasonable and believable … I could respect that.

Come on greenie ... you can do it ... shake loose of that rigid thinking. The fact is that it is clear to everyone that you don't know bumpkis about biology, so stop trying to argue about it ... learn and then make up your mind.

 

[Thalassamania]

Mix with n-cans of time.

I love it! But shouldn't the label say "organic?" Or shouldn't it be RAmen?

 

[Bryan]

I love it! But shouldn't the label say "organic?"

Maybe, LOL!

I wasn't sure about the concentration... I thought maybe n-cans would provide just the right delusion, er, uh dillution.

Here's the view of a creationist who doesn't exclude evolution:

 

[agilis]

Primitive snakes generally have vestigial legs. GreenM. writes that "a snake was found", etc. Again, a case of a little knowledge being a dangerous thing. Dangerous to accurate understanding, in this instance.
Snakes are descended from lizards, and this family connection is clearest in those snakes least evolved. All Boas, for example, have 'spurs', the structural remnants of ancestral hind legs. Skeletal examination makes this crystal clear.

 

[Soggy]

I understand the theory of evolution very well.

Your demonstrated understanding of the theory of evolution is less than that of a high school student in freshman biology. Just because you write that you understand it, doesn't mean that you do.

"I understand brain neurology very well."
"I understand rocket science very well."

See, I wrote something, but that doesn't mean it's true. If you ask me questions about it, I could make up answers, just like you did about them, but I'd look silly and my answers wouldn't make any sense. Sort of like what you've been doing.

 

[Bryan]

I love it! But shouldn't the label say "organic?" Or shouldn't it be RAmen?

I missed your edit... RAmen? What does that refer to (other than the noodles)?

 

[Thalassamania]

That's what worshipers of the Flying Spaghetti Monster say at the end of a prayer: RAmen.

 

[Bryan]

Aah, that religion.

Their followers have been known to chant the following during their prayers:

Re-duct-i-o ad ab-sur-dum
Ad hom-i-nem
bel-la ger-ant al-i-i
Ar-cus se-nil-is
RAAAA-men