mcohen1021
Contributor
Good lord, your DM sounds incompetent... Who is that so I make sure I never dive with him?
Cozumel incident but lesson learned
- Thread starter gt2003
- Start date
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I'm going to disagree with your statement. In general, every diver is responsible for their own dive. However...
1. In Coz, dives must be led by a DM. The OP used good judgment in hiring a private DM that was supposed to be attentive to just the OP and his wife.
2. The OP listened to, and actively participated in, the dive planning.
3. The OP did his best to communicate with the DM during the dive.
If the OP is guilty of anything it is failing to ask the DM during the dive briefing "And what should I do if you completely ignore me and my wife underwater and you fail to follow the dive plan that we have just agreed to?"
But... the OP probably (and reasonably) assumed that asking the DM this question would have been as relevant as asking what he should do if aliens abducted the DM mid-dive. That is, who would even think a DM ditching the dive plan and his divers would be a reasonable consideration?
The OP did everything reasonable, within his training (he was essentially doing a refresher dive) and within the expectations of the DM he hired. I'm going to put at least 99% of the poor decision making in this incident on the DM.
gcarter
Contributor
I will again disagree. You started out ok by saying "In general, every diver is responsible for their own dive."
You fell apart when you took that responsibility away from him. I will grant you your points 1 through 3. None of this changes the fact that when the DM deviated from the plan and led the OP into a dangerous situation, the OP needed to be able to recognize that, take responsibility away from the DM and say NO. That is what the OP has learned, and he says so in his post:
1. The divemaster is a guide. Don't rely on them 100%. If he hadn't been there I would have done my safety stop then ascended to the surface with around 4-500 lbs of air. However, I allowed the mindset that "he'll take care of me" to overrule my common sense. DON'T BE ME>>>Lesson Learned.
He knew what he should have done, but failed to do so because he was doing a "trust me" dive. If you make a decision to do a "trust me" dive, you are as equally responsible for the outcome as the person who leads you into danger because of the decision you made. This was not a class, or an instructor - student situation.
I’m not really sure what concerns me more (or if they can even be compared): divemasters doing things like this, or divers who seem unable to complete a safe dive without having to have a DM tell them what to do.
Things I’ve seen DMs do (incidentally, these were all in Cozumel, but that’s likely more about the fact that I’ve done the vast majority of my “resort” boat diving there than it is about the specific location):
Things I’ve seen DMs do (incidentally, these were all in Cozumel, but that’s likely more about the fact that I’ve done the vast majority of my “resort” boat diving there than it is about the specific location):
- Ignore divers indicating they’ve reached their NDL (“it’s ok, it’s ok, my computer says I’m fine”)
- Ignore divers signalling low on air (700 psi) and continuing ahead on the dive
- Physically pulling a diver down below his safety stop depth (to the point where his computer was no longer crediting time for the safety stop)
- Going into deco and running out of air (yes, while in deco), requiring an air share
Agree with all and take full responsibility for my ignorance. No excuses. The sad thing is, I was fully aware and followed anyway for whatever reason. I won't even try to justify that. If my wife and I were diving alone this wouldn't have happened. So, I'll take the hit on this one but thought it was valuable to share.
@lionfish-eater , I had 200 the last time I showed it to him and used that during the safety stop then went of his air.
@lionfish-eater , I had 200 the last time I showed it to him and used that during the safety stop then went of his air.
gcarter
Contributor
When I am diving with someone who is likely to need an air share, I generally make them take my octo once they hit 500 psi. This way, if they are forced to go back on their own tank for any reason they will more likely have enough to surface safely on their own. I don't let a buddy get down to 200 psi. Something else to consider.
This matters, too. Doing a dive on Lock 23 in the St. Lawrence a few years ago, I was buddied with a new diver, his first river current / drift dive. He was on an AL80, I was on a HP117. As we were exiting the lock and starting the long swim in, he hit 500 psi so I put him on my octo. During the briefing I had told him how to position himself and to hold my tank valve to maintain his relative position should we need to share. He didn't do this, and was all over the place, biting down hard on the mouthpiece and pulling on the hose with it. About halfway in, he managed to bite completely through the mouthpiece. Because he still had air in his tank, I put him back on his own, and we were close enough (and shallow enough) that he was able to finish the dive safely. Mind you, we could have easily surfaced, but it is a much easier swim in underwater with fewer risks associated with boat traffic.
gcarter
Contributor
Everyone will eventually have a "moment" if they dive enough.
Because you expected the DM, presumably being more qualified than yourself, to guide you on the dive and conclude the dive after you communicated that you were at the agreed pressure. This is a reasonable expectation.
The challenge is, how long do you wait before you decide that it’s not going to happen? Is the DM just about to ascend, or just about to put up his buoy? How long do you wait to see if he does it before realizing you have to ascend on your own? After this experience, I bet it won’t be as long the next time (although hopefully there doesn’t need to be a “next time” like this).
In the examples I gave, my buddy and I were the ones who ran low on NDL, and we waited a few more minutes (until we’d basically gotten 2-3 mins of deco) before agreeing between ourselves to thumb the dive and ascend on our own. The low on air? Happened to my buddy, and I sent up my SMB and we ascended by the time he got down to 400. Even both of those are arguably cases of waiting too long.
It can be tough to make that call to go against a more experienced diver, but the rule of “any diver, at any time, for any reason” for aborting a dive should still apply, and if whatever was briefed isn’t being followed (e.g. everyone coming up together) then don’t be afraid to do what you have to do to end the dive safely.
gcarter
Contributor
It occasionally happens with new divers not used to current. Some of the shore based drift dives in the river can be shortened by surface swimming in, but the preference is to stay under. Depths when this happens are typically at 20 FFW.
But I formed the policy for my own purpose. I actually thought about what would / could happen if I had to share air. Before I needed to. Just in case. This was very early in my diving.
Not every policy / plan / contingency is formed on a reactive basis, your amazement notwithstanding.
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