Cozumel Incident 9/4/11

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Your deep air record discussion was removed from the original thread because it was off topic. It is still off topic. In fact, given that deep air as a concept played a major part in this tragedy, I would say that it is morbidly off topic.

If you are interested, I suggest that you go to the Tech diving forum and start a new thread there. As for me, I have nearly zero interest in the facts related to setting deep air records.

So John back to our original discussion from the other day about those world records I posted ....do you know if those were done on a single tank? Also let's say forget all the official calculations for a minute.......isn't it reasonable to conceive that maybe some people who have done these types of dives have actually NOT done all the so called proper safety stops but yet still seem to make it out of the water just fine? Thanks.
 
I've been to Cozumel once. It was where I decided I wanted to learn to scuba dive. But the more I read over the years on this board the less I want to go there. Bad judgment and what I consider to be unsafe practices by some ops and "professionals" more and more turn me away. I will not recommend it to any of my students.
What happened in this case is NOT typical of the diving around Cozumel, especially that done on guided dives with dive ops. I will still go to Cozumel at least yearly and I won't worry the slightest bit that my DM will drag me to 300' on a dive. Beyond that, we are each of us ultimately responsible for our own safety irrespective of what others are doing around us. Do what you want, but IMO your fears are unfounded.
 
Some people are more known quantities than others... Not trying to be insulting but if you were to have posted details about what was taking place in Cozumel or Bora Bora for that matter, why would anyone believe you with your 11 posts (currently) and living in Florida? Whereas many people who are discussing this (mostly behind the scenes in Private Messages and outside of SB) are key players in the Cozumel dive industry and have direct communications with people right in the middle of this.. They are not armchair quarterbacking.. But, everyone can deduce what they like..

You can almost be certain in most dive incidents / accidents there are people out there that know much more than the rest of people in these forums. Generally speaking, their priority is not to share information with you.. Be happy when it does happen and try to learn from it no matter if you believe all of what is disclosed or not..

Having a whole bunch of posts on SB doesn't really mean you know what you are talking about. People lurk on this board for years as guest and maybe never sign up. Some sign up and put their 2 cents in everywhere. It would be Dandy if someone does post the facts. Maybe yours are correct maybe they aren't. You seem to hitting the like button on any post that indicates it was divers just being stupid so maybe you have another agenda- IDK and again maybe your report is factual, maybe it isn't.
 
What happened in this case is NOT typical of the diving around Cozumel, especially that done on guided dives with dive ops. I will still go to Cozumel at least yearly and I won't worry the slightest bit that my DM will drag me to 300' on a dive. Beyond that, we are each of us ultimately responsible for our own safety irrespective of what others are doing around us. Do what you want, but IMO your fears are unfounded.

Yep, ditto Gordon.
 
Your deep air record discussion was removed from the original thread because it was off topic. It is still off topic. In fact, given that deep air as a concept played a major part in this tragedy, I would say that it is morbidly off topic.

If you are interested, I suggest that you go to the Tech diving forum and start a new thread there. As for me, I have nearly zero interest in the facts related to setting deep air records.

Not quite sure how it is off topic since the incident described here is exactly the same thing but thanks anyway. As far as off topic.......that went out the window in this thread about 10 pages ago FWIW.
 
Your account has basically contradicted that of one of the divers who was ACTUALLY on the dive himself.
You do realize that if the account is accurate, as it appears to be, the people with the least incentive to explain the details accurately are those who were actually on the dive?
 
You do realize that if the account is accurate, as it appears to be, the people with the least incentive to explain the details accurately are those who were actually on the dive?

Maybe-maybe not. If the divers are lying then who can know what is true? Witnesses? Just sayin' who knows? How do they know for sure if they weren't there?
 
Maybe-maybe not. If the divers are lying then who can know what is true? Witnesses? Just sayin' who knows? How do they know for sure if they weren't there?
The divers were not the only ones there. They got on and off a boat that had a crew. They were associated with a dive shop that had people involved from the before the time the boat left to the time they arrived at the chamber. Lots of people know what actually happened.
 
Having a whole bunch of posts on SB doesn't really mean you know what you are talking about. People lurk on this board for years as guest and maybe never sign up. Some sign up and put their 2 cents in everywhere. It would be Dandy if someone does post the facts. Maybe yours are correct maybe they aren't. You seem to hitting the like button on any post that indicates it was divers just being stupid so maybe you have another agenda- IDK and again maybe your report is factual, maybe it isn't.

Really? He already explained why.......

As I have previously mentioned, I am not posting any of this to embarrass or hurt anyone. I’m releasing the information that I know relating to this to:
a) Defend Cozumel as a safe place to dive; and
b) Hopefully reach other divers who might have wild ideas about pushing way past the established limits without the proper training, equipment and planning And show them what can happen if they do.

There are many people passing around the same info about the incident. This info was coming out eventually so what is with the alternate agenda stuff?
 
I am following this post and I agree with what Boulderjim just stated about the difference of recreational and tech diving and planning for the "ceiling". In August 2004, my wife, myself and a friend were staying at the then Reef Club resort and did dives with the resort's dive shop (don't remember their name but they were not good). We did two morning dives, the Santa Rosa wall and I believe the Paso del Cedral wall.The first dive was a total cluster----' with the DM taking us into the current until HE got swept away. We then aborted the dive at that point. The next dive, we were riding the current after descending to a depth of 102 feet and just slowly cruising the reef wall as we slowly ascended. (The plan) At about 80 feet, we came upon what I would describe as a sand wash. An area of the reef devoid of coral, just sand. As we tried to cross this area which was maybe 30 to 40 feet in width, we got caught in a downdraft. Our friend swam into the current until he could grab hold of thoe reef on the other side, I pushed my wife across until she too could grab the reef. I was swept further down until about 120 ft where I finally made it out of the downdraft. Immediately saw above me the videographer (who was buddied to our friend) signal that he was low on air. I got to him and handed off my alternate. We then ascended and
Met up with my wife and friend and went to safety stop depth. When we first hit this downdraft, we were probably 45 to 50 minutes into our dive and the three of us had 1200 to 1600 psi at the time. At the safety stop, probably not more than five or six minutes later, the three of us were at 500 to 600 psi. The video guy was out of air.
We shared air until we were all almost out and then we surfaced. Longer than the three minute safety stop but I didn't record that time. What I remember most immediately after the dive was the feeling that at 120 feet, my 12 pounds of weight felt like I had 50 pounds on. The other memory was that at that depth adding air in my BC had no immediate effect. Although I was sharing air on the ascent and at safety stop I was still shocked at how fast my remaining 1600 psi got consumed. My point of adding this story is not to say how good or how lucky I was, I had 300 plus dives when this had occurred, it is to say no matter your experience level, when you run across a situation that is new to you, you are not "experienced". Would I dive again in Cozumel, certainly and in fact will be doing so the week of September 19. I totally agree with the above post that the dive ops on Cozumel have come a long way in the past decade. Their safety record shows that. I think of my episode as a learning experience for which I am grateful to be able to learn from without it becoming serious. Further, I was with a diver who had a serious DCS hit on a 70 foot dive with no current and spent six hours in a chamber. It was the third dive on a trip to the Turks and Caicos with calm waters and no contributing factors evident as to why he took a hit. Diving does have risk, it also has the thrill, allure and beauty that calls us. When I leave this earth I will be glad for all the joys I have known and not worry about the things I have missed. PPS. Thanks to this board I have a wealth of info on how to deal with downdrafts.

I have to call BS on this post........depth to 102ft GRADUAL assent up to 80 ft... 50 min into this dive and still 1600 psi? What's that give a SAC of about 0.0001?
 
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