CO Death Myth

[robbcayman]

Another post wrote the chances of dying of CO poisoning are astronomical. Well sure.. it's also astronomical odds that you will die from CO in your house, but having a detector is a wise move. If someone dies from CO poisoning in the states we don't say it's their fault, but it was their responsibility to buy some monitors to safeguard their lives. That's the thing with this world, you must look out for yourself as there is danger everywhere. That doesn't mean you should be paranoid, but cautious people tend to live longer.

I've been to Cozumel several times and I can attest it is a very safe place to dive. However, that doesn't mean you wouldn't be wise to take precautions to safeguard your life. Worst case scenario, a guy buys a CO detector and never gets a positive hit. If he doesn't buy one and dives with too much CO he may never come back. I just fail to see the harm in testing your tank. I don't think anyone is blaming Cozumel.. this is just about personal responsibility.

 

[Prop Joe]

Home made re-breather?
Did anyone check if the sorb was used up?
Was the scrubber even working correctly?

 

[DandyDon]

Firstdive you said CO2 tester but I think you meant CO? Big difference, potentially confusing. BTW, you were welcome to borrow mine in August but I guess I didn't broadcast that.

Another post wrote the chances of dying of CO poisoning are astronomical. Well sure.. it's also astronomical odds that you will die from CO in your house, but having a detector is a wise move. If someone dies from CO poisoning in the states we don't say it's their fault, but it was their responsibility to buy some monitors to safeguard their lives. That's the thing with this world, you must look out for yourself as there is danger everywhere. That doesn't mean you should be paranoid, but cautious people tend to live longer.

I've been to Cozumel several times and I can attest it is a very safe place to dive. However, that doesn't mean you wouldn't be wise to take precautions to safeguard your life. Worst case scenario, a guy buys a CO detector and never gets a positive hit. If he doesn't buy one and dives with too much CO he may never come back. I just fail to see the harm in testing your tank. I don't think anyone is blaming Cozumel.. this is just about personal responsibility.

Good attitude.

It is sad that only a third of American homes have CO monitors. Those are cheap. I like AC with battery backup, one for every bedroom, minimum two per home. $24 for 5 years: Walmart.com: Kidde AC/DC Carbon Monoxide Alarm: Home Security plus $1/year for batteries.

 

[WSOPFAN]

Really, I have?

Yea you remember the post in A&I that you suggested you know all kinds of versions to this story but never returned to say anything after you were told to stop spreading your BS lies.

Just for clarification sake:

The 6 CO poisonings a couple of years ago were at one resort who was filling their own tanks. These tanks were not filled by the central fill station that fills most ops tanks here.

Thanks to Dave Dillehay, Meridiano, the central fill station that does fill most ops tanks here now has inline CO monitors.

Obviously tanks in Playa del Carmen tanks are not filled in Cozumel so really have absolutely nothing to do with Cozumel incidents of diver death or CO poisoning here.

As has been mentioned, a small pocket CO monitor is not an accurate gauge of the CO in a tank for recreational diving purposes.

I am still not convinced that the cause of death of the Cave Diver was CO poisoning. Not only are there many conflicting reports, but no one else with tanks from the same fill station at the same time had a problem. Additionally, there are reports that his dive buddies claim that the diver had complained of not feeling well the day before or that morning, but followed through with the dive. Of course it is all hearsay, but it is hearsay from both sides. Only the Dr.'s performing the autopsy actually know!

Then this was posted by dive-aholic:

By Christi
Additionally, there are reports that his dive buddies claim that the diver had complained of not feeling well the day before or that morning, but followed through with the dive.

By Dive-aholic



Not sure where you heard this but it is absolutely not true. At no time did Brendan complain of not feeling well. Please stop spreading BS rumors.

Uh yea really you have. Like to add anything else?

 

[Christi]

I am not sure if you or Dave has read the thread about this in A&I but many things were covered there. There were news articles, posts from another board, posts from this person's dive buddies one of whom was actually there. It was reported in that thread by his buddy that the diver had elevated carboxyhemoglobin levels which he later clarified to be lethally elevated levels. Now how does he know this? Was he told by the coroner or see the report? In any case this completely contradicts what Dave and others are claiming. This poster also explained how a single tank can become contaminated in that type of filling environment. Again Dave claims it is not possible and also states the claims from this incident are causing harm to the tourism as it has been reported falsely. The article posted with the information about the coroner's report is actually not from Por Esto but another paper. After I read the information on the A&I thread I believe it to be accurate unless and until PROVEN to be incorrect. I have asked for proof of that here and got nothing but somebody told him this or that or I live here so I should know. That is not good enough and if that were my relative or family member I would be furious that someone would post such inflammatory comments without stating absolute proof. I agree there is the possibility that some facts of the story may have been passed along mistakenly but these issues were raised in a thread in A&I by Christi and the dive buddy in question stated she was lying and now here we are again and some are claiming the same things.

I was LYING? Maybe you should re-read the only post/comment I have made on this topic. I am lying about the fact that there were/are many conflicting stories going around about this? And I think the mere fact that the subject is being debated is evidence that there are different versions and opinions of what happened, why should I come back to rehash the same stories others have already posted? I am not a Dr. or a cave diver and have no knowledge on this accident other than what I have heard here and read in these two threads. I merely shared what I heard, nothing more.

Maybe it's not true that he was feeling ill the day before, and maybe it's not true that his buddies made this claim - but it IS TRUE that that is one of the stories I have heard - aI actually heard this from someone that was on the scene when he was brought out of the cenote, so I guess that person was lying or misunderstood what they heard.

I am not "spreading BS rumors" - the extent of my discussion of this topic with ANYONE was when the story was originally relayed to me and in my post in the A & I thread - again, I merely stated what I have heard. I never stated anything as fact.

As to the CO monitors accuracy, I probably misspoke on that, but I have had several tech divers and people that are knowledgeable on the topic tell me that they weren't accurate - and in that post, I was referencing something I thought I had read in a previous post that seemed to back that up, but I can't find it now.

As for why I didn't return to the post, I didn't ever return to that thread to read the follow-ups, no particular reason, I just didn't think about it.

Finally WSO - just because I may not have opinions that you agree with, or because I make an erroneous statement, doen not mean that I am LYING or participating in some conspiracy to hide or conceal the facts - this is just a discussion, and unlike you - I can accept and admit that I don't know everything about everything and I make mistakes.

Here is exactly what I posted and the direct link to my post:

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ac...-york-tourist-dies-cozumel-4.html#post6115740

I am still not convinced that the cause of death of the Cave Diver was CO poisoning. Not only are there many conflicting reports, but no one else with tanks from the same fill station at the same time had a problem. Additionally, there are reports that his dive buddies claim that the diver had complained of not feeling well the day before or that morning, but followed through with the dive. Of course it is all hearsay, but it is hearsay from both sides. Only the Dr.'s performing the autopsy actually know!

 

[Ron Lee]

Let us just accept that the Paterno Effect may be at play here as well as in the Scuba Mau divers deep diving incident.

I have known Dave Dillehay for several years and do not question his integrity.

His enjoyment of swim throughs (the smaller the better it seems) is another matter....but I digress.

 

[WSOPFAN]

Christi,

I don't need to read it again......I just stated what you were lying and or spreading rumors about and it was not me that pointed it out to you. He was there I think he would know.....I don't care what stories you heard about who the guy told you it was false. BTW in A&I you are supposed to report first hand accounts not what you heard from someone and pass it along as the truth. Now WHAT conflicting stories do you know of that suggest the cause of death is wrong?

 

[Christi]

Christi,

I don't need to read it again......I just stated what you were lying and or spreading rumors about and it was not me that pointed it out to you. He was there I think he would know.....I don't care what stories you heard about who the guy told you it was false. BTW in A&I you are supposed to report first hand accounts not what you heard from someone and pass it along as the truth. Now WHAT conflicting stories do you know of that suggest the cause of death is wrong?

Well shoot me then - I guess I didn't read the rules on the A & I forum.

I edited my post to add to it, but as Dave has patiently tried to explain to you - the local coroner's report is not necessarily accurate.

I am not going to debate this with you - I have better things to do with my time and don't really have any obligation or desire to indulge you. I will not be replying to your antagonistic, demeaning and insulting posts anymore, so it's up to you if you want to waste your time trying.

 

[WSOPFAN]

Like I said neither you or Dave has posted anything to prove what you claim. A deceased diver had a coroner conclude that he died from CO poisoning. It was reported by his dive team members that they were informed of a test that showed lethally elevated levels of carboyxhemoglobin........Was the test merely an ABG or CBC or in fact a spectroscopic test......unknown.............BUT Dave claims in post #4 "I reported that there NEVER was a test for Carboxyhemoglobin."

One party says there was a test one party says no.
Someone is giving false information possibly unknowingly because both parties can't be correct.

If you 2 are so convinced that the "conflicting" stories you have heard or medical people who say the cause of death is wrong due to coroner error or outright lies, then show us your proof until then I will believe what has been reported by his dive team period.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I was a victim of CO poisoning once and it was absolutely no fun.
It wasn't scuba air related, it was a car running in a building that made me sick and I almost didn't make it according to experts I spoke with later. I never lost conciousness but almost. I felt sicker than hell for two days afterward.
If there is CO in tanks in the places mentioned perhaps people are feeling sick without knowing why. I could see how a hit of CO could be misconstrued as a hit of DCS with the symtoms I had and the symtoms described many times as what is DCS.
The very incideous thing about CO is that a person can get out of the toxic environment and then later reach the point of no return. The other very scary thing about CO poisoning is that there is no immediate cure other than pure 02 however since CO blocks 02 absorbtion 100% 02 is basically worthless since you can't absorb it anyway. You just have to hope that it's not bad enough that you don't suffocate to death knowing there's not a damn thing you can do about it.