Climate Change

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A lot of good points being brought up about this issue. I did check the link Skull provided and googled "Hadley Hacked." The implications are explosive; the timing is impeccable.

Maybe we should look at this crisis from what we can observe and not from what the "experts" tell us.

It's common knowlege that the polar icecaps are shrinking. The highest ski resort in the world which used to be in Peru doesn't have a glacier to ski on anymore. They had one in the 70's. In fact, Glacier National Park has lost more than half of its glaciers since 1940. These are things we can observe.

When I first join this forum I started a thread about changes in your local dive site. There were only a handful of responses and nobody talked about water temperature. I have noticed a flattening of temps at my local dive sites (East Coast of Korea) over the last five years which I've documented in my log book. Winter water temps aren't as cold as they used to be; 35 deg F in 2005, now usually 42 deg F. Summer used to be 73 deg F only in late Aug early Sep. Now it's around 76 from late Jul to late Sep. These are variations I have observed. Check your log books and see what's been happening to your local dive sites over the last few years. You may be surprised.

When the United States refused to sign the Kyoto Protocol, we said we wouldn't ratify it because it would damage our economy and siphon off our wealth the form of a cap and trade system on carbon. The first part of that statement is partially true. It would make our carbon based economy more expensive, but think of what it would have done to our economy if we had taken the challenge as seriously as we did the space race in the '60's and developed "green" technologies. Our economy would have taken off in a new direction and would still be going strong.

As for the second part of that statement, siphoning off our wealth, that is already happening and has been happening since the late '40's in the form of oil imports. OPEC nations have become fabulously wealthy thanks to our insatiable appetite for oil.

What really bothers me is other countries are taking climate change seriously and investing in "green" technologies. As I mentioned above, I currently live in Korea. I have noticed over the last five years an investment in solar farms, solar panels and water heaters on houses and apartment buildings, replacement of oil heating systems for electric and natural gas. Brazil is dominant in ethanol fuels and Sweden has the Hydrogen Highway. The point is, these other countries like Korea, Brazil and the EU are going to beat us at our own game. At this rate, when we finally get serious, we'll have to buy back "green" technology from our competitors. Talk about a siphoning of wealth!

Peter C has is right about pollution. Again, pollution is something we can observe. I've read a lot of news about the email leaks from CRU but I haven't found the 64 MB zip file they're allegedly in. With Copenhagen just a few days away, I have to wonder if they really exist or if this is an ingenious ploy to upset the convention.

I'll close with a twist on a quote from Rex Weyler; future generations are going to look back on us as barbarians because we tore up the planet and we knew what we were doing.
 
Everything in moderation folks ...especially moderation ...

There used to be giant ski slopes over the great lakes 15k yrs ago...course nobody skied them back then ...where did all that ice go?

Point is the earth has been warmer than now and colder than now ... big deal. But it hasn't had this level of man made pollution. Lets keep it clean- ay kids.
 
IMHO - AGW is a huge man made, for profit hoax. It's admirable, the other, more conventional, faith based religions took centuries to achieve the same level of fanaticism in their advocates.

I'm against any application of the hoax to cheat or transfer wealth on the arbitrary basis proposed (person to person, country to country).

However, it seems:

1 - reduction in pollution and taking care of the resources is a positive thing in and of itself, no religion is required to make people see the sense of that. In fact, it's counterproductive to the goal of a cleaner planet. Artificial transfer of $$$ from advanced nations to the most polluted and inefficient nations just takes resources from those that invent and gives it to those that pollute the worst.

2 - lower cost energy is a goal that is self sustaining as a good personal or business or industry choice - and it will be naturally driven by the profit motive. Unnaturally "forcing" the cost of existing energy sources only delays (in the long term) the true needs for energy companies to explore alternative sources as a direct result of market forces.

being cleaner? it will happen, it'll be driven by need for efficiencies in the long run. It's also just smarter and more comfortable

AGW hysteria - hurts the true cause more than helps in the long run. But at least some hacks can cash in on it - so that must make it ok
 
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