Calling off the trip

[Tortuga James]

How do you guys handle this? Diving out of Morehead City, NC. I had a group yesterday that I could not convince to call off the trip. The wind had been blowing 20 kts SW for 3 straight days. The offshore buoy showed 4' waves with a 4 sec interval. Forecast was for 3-5.

I run a 31' x 12 custom boat, and she can safely handle those seas, but it is a long 35 miles to the site and marginally safe to dive in those conditions, especially considering the water temps are mid 60's.

I gave the group a chance to call it off the day before, and not drive the 3 hours to the coast. They still wanted to try, so I said we will evaluate at the dock in the morning. We woke up to a stiff breeze and I told them it was going to be really rough and we could call it if they want and get a refund. They wanted to see for themselves, so we hammered our way out to the sea buoy (6 miles) at 10 knots and finally the group leader called "uncle" and we turned around. I would have given it about another 30 minutes before I made the call, but I wanted them to call it. There was not a chance in the world I was putting divers in the water.

I was pleasant enough. I feel like if I hadn't taken them to prove my point, they would have gone away thinking it was a diveable day and that I called it without good reason.

Should have I given them a refund? How would you have handled it?

 

[SkipperJohn]

You're the captain and their lives are in your hands. I would have canceled it without option. I've cancelled many fishing trips for that reason. Even a few I wish I hadn't because NOAA & the weather didn't play nice together. In the end everyone I canceled came to respect my reason.
As far as refunding their fee. Well, at their insistance you got up, untied, spent your time, burned fuel. At the very least they should have been obligated to reimburse you for your time and expenses. But this is the kind of thing you need to make clear before the engines are started.

 

[ChunksJR]

How do you guys handle this? Diving out of Morehead City, NC. I had a group yesterday that I could not convince to call off the trip. The wind had been blowing 20 kts SW for 3 straight days. The offshore buoy showed 4' waves with a 4 sec interval. Forecast was for 3-5.

I was pleasant enough. I feel like if I hadn't taken them to prove my point, they would have gone away thinking it was a diveable day and that I called it without good reason.

Should have I given them a refund? How would you have handled it?

Skipper,

I'll be one of those divers in a few months...since I'm heading up to VA Beach for my next tour.

As a helicopter pilot, I'll tell you how you handle it:

"It's my boat and I'm not putting it or your lives in risk" or better yet "You are my responsibility and I can't justify going out there right now...risks outweigh the benifits"

Then short of refunds, give them a "voucher" for return another time. As one of your future customers, I'd more than understand.

And you can't please all the people all the time...we try, but it's just not safe and death by ignorance is still death.

Drive safe, skip, we'll see you in July!

~dan

 

[Tom Winters]

Give them a refund. No voucher. These guys really wanted to dive, and if you had not taken them out, next time they would have gone with another outfit. You were not to run that day anyway so you're only out some fuel and time.
Now that you have the foul weather connection with them, get in contact with them when the seas are diveable.
If the seas are just not going to work and you have a hale-and-hearty group that is hours away, tell them way before they leave home to canx the dive and save themselves the drive. Make this point emphatically. Make them understand that there is nothing you want more in the world than to take their money from them, but sometimes you just can't go offshore.
Sometimes, no matter what you do, you'll lose a client this way. Better than losing them offshore.

 

[firstdive2005]

Man you've got a good heart. I'm thinking I run into issues where not enough communication is done. As such I go with Tom's thought, refund them they will be back because they know your a good guy to deal with.
I may have said emphatically at first. OK guys I would rather not go it's a bit rough but doable. Usually people dont like to traverse these waters when it's this rough. You guys want to try I'm ok with that this is fair warning right now you get full refunds and I hope you come back on a fair weather day. If we go out and you want to come back I would like to be paid for the fuel, is that fair? I think most would not be upset with that. Everything is clear.

 

[Eastbayfe]

I hope they appreciated the time and effort you spent educating them on non-divable coastal conditions. Maybe they'll put that to future use.

I had been a guest on a sportfishing trip out of Oregon Inlet some time ago. The captain recommended that we cancel for a refund since the forecast looked bad and the wind was steadily picking up. One of the group knowing that this would probably be his only chance at a trip that season insisted we make the trip. We were the only boat that left the harbor. We got about 45 minutes of fishing in after runing out and had to call the rest of the day to fight 35 knot winds with heavy swells all the way in. We were rolling from sheerline to sheerline as the captain made way through the swells. I swore that day that I'd not be put in that situation again.

 

[SkipperJohn]

I hope they appreciated the time and effort you spent educating them on non-divable coastal conditions. Maybe they'll put that to future use.

I had been a guest on a sportfishing trip out of Oregon Inlet some time ago. The captain recommended that we cancel for a refund since the forecast looked bad and the wind was steadily picking up. One of the group knowing that this would probably be his only chance at a trip that season insisted we make the trip. We were the only boat that left the harbor. We got about 45 minutes of fishing in after runing out and had to call the rest of the day to fight 35 knot winds with heavy swells all the way in. We were rolling from sheerline to sheerline as the captain made way through the swells. I swore that day that I'd not be put in that situation again.

I can't tell you how many times I've heard this.

 

[ChunksJR]

We were the only boat that left the harbor.

I swore that day that I'd not be put in that situation again.

I know that it's not a boat, but It's pricetag was very similar...

This happened to me at my last tour, as an instructor...I "swore" I could get it done safely (staying below the clouds) and all my fellow pilots said "Give us PIREPS (pilot reports on wx, etc)"

Never did give a pirep becasue I was busy @#$%@#%'in' my pants because of the weather I got into.

Ended up landing in a field and shutting down, because the student next to me sure as hell wasn't going to help.

From then on out, I was the guy WAITING on other's PIREPS.

~D

 

[dbulmer]

James,
Over here it works as follows:

1) Skipper is in charge. When the dive is booked - it is booked.

If the divers call off the dive, the divers pay the skipper.
If the skipper calls off the dive the skippers refunds the money.

Divers call the skipper the night before the dive to confirm or can the dive, check conditions etc

In the situation you described where the divers ignored your advice I would not give them refunds. At the end of the day James you are the skipper and the divers should be listening to you.

I know this seems a little black and white but I was taught to respect the skipper and to abide by his rules even though personally I might not always agree with it.

 

[cappyjon431]

It is never fun to be the bad guy, but sometimes it is a necessity. Many years ago I was captaining a liveaboard and we were scheduled to be diving off of Freeport & Port Lucaya. Mother Nature would not cooperate and we had 8-10 foot seas (it was a very stable liveaboard, but diving in those types of sea conditions is dangerous). The weather fax said the conditions would stay the same for a couple of days. I made the decision to go into Freeport harbor (with the blessing of the company president). At first, I almost had a full scale mutiny on my hands. Many asked why we couldn't dive on the leeward side of Grand Bahama (because it is a very shallow sand bar, that's why!) or just stay out on our mooring until the weather improved. I brought the boat into the harbor, paid for taxis to take everybody sightseeing/shopping, and then went into town to stretch my legs. While in town I picked up a Miami Herald which had on its front page a headline that said, "20 Die in Dive Boat Mishap." It was talking about the Wave Dancer tragedy which happened in Belize the day before (Hurricane Iris?). I returned to the boat, cut out the headline, and put it up on our bulletin board. When our guests returned from sightseeing, they gathered around the bulletin board and read quietly. That day every one of our guests thanked me for making the unpopular decision to put the boat in port.