breath holding is a "no no"... but?

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james386

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hello everyone. I am a newly certified ow diver (as in finished july 22) the basic concepts weren't difficult, and I had no problems with the skills. however, I did have one issue, and after reading many of the incident reports elswhere on the forums, I have some questions.

first, my "problem" is that in fresh water, even with a thin full suit, I am negatively bouyant. at first, I thought, "great, I hated the damn weight belt anyway." but that being the case, I take a very deep breath to arrest a descent, or initiate an ascent. in either case, i have been holding my breath until I establish the desired result, Ie. when arresting a descent, hold until level, or to begin ascent, hold until upward motion begins. and then either breath with more or less full lungs to maintain the desired motion. I try to keep the air in my bc to a minimum, because with more air, expansion/compression has a large effect on bouyancy, and makes it harder to smoothly change depth.

in a descent, it shouldn't present a problem. on ascent, holding a second or two too long would be a bad thing. my concern is this- it doesn't take rocket science to remember to breath under normal conditons. however, I have read several instances of experienced divers having over expansion injuries, where the most likely cause was breath holding due to panic. and if it's my normal habit to do short breath holds to initiate depth change as explained above, am I setting myself up in a potentially dangerous situation, where if things go suddenly and terribly wrong I make the mistake of breath holding because I'm used to it?

I will state that all my prior hobbies have been ones that help to mute a panic response because when things go bad it happens quickly, and panic/freezing have bad results, so I fortunately tend to react to sudden stressful situations effectively. (of course none of those have ever been air failure at 60')

Anyway, there's my first dumb question. I hope there aren't many more, but I'm sure there will be.

Lynn
 
Fine tuning with the breath is one thing, but it sounds like either you're relying on it way too much, or you're over-thinking this.

It's nice to have minimal air in your BC, but buoyancy control is what it is there for. Possibly you should be using it more, and learning to deal with it. And don't forget you can initiate ascents and descents simply by swimming.

What kind of tank are you using? If you are by any chance using steel tanks, maybe try AL.
 
thanks for the quick response.... well, I'm pretty sure that I'm over thinking it, because it's been running around in my head all day, trying to decide if what I'm doing is what people *actually* mean by never hold your breath, or if they *literally* mean "don't hold your breath" but I sure don't want to underthink it. AL is better than steel, but still a 1 way ticket to the bottom... I get that the bc is for exactly that. I just want to make sure that I'm not using equipment as a band-aid to cover up poor skills/technique.
 
Slowing and stopping your descent is probably better done using your BCD rather than your lungs if for no other reason than to avoid the development of bad habits. Reserve adjusting your breathing pattern to make small changes in buoyancy, not big changes.

You need to use your BCD to establish and maintain neutral buoyancy which includes adding air to get neutral when necessary.
 
thanks for the quick response.... well, I'm pretty sure that I'm over thinking it, because it's been running around in my head all day, trying to decide if what I'm doing is what people *actually* mean by never hold your breath, or if they *literally* mean "don't hold your breath" but I sure don't want to underthink it. AL is better than steel, but still a 1 way ticket to the bottom... I get that the bc is for exactly that. I just want to make sure that I'm not using equipment as a band-aid to cover up poor skills/technique.

I SO understand where you're coming from. Going through the certification process this week, I find that I can hardly fully concentrate on anything OTHER than scuba right now, because I am over-thinking so much of it. But I just want to be sure I get it RIGHT, ya know? Yeah. I know you know!
 
Not dumb question at all. This one of those things that seems to pop up when new divers are not told just how dangerous this is in plain english. It is true that experienced divers die from embolisms. And some may be from panic. There are those however that are the result of a prior, sometimes unkown, medical condition.

But to more directly address your question regarding holding your breath, the short answer is don't. It can kill you. In a very nasty and painful way. It is also quite upsetting for fellow divers to see someone lying on the deck or shore with bloody froth coming out of their mouth. You can embolize in as little as four feet of water. At depth, a buoyancy change of that magnitude is not as serious as it happening near the surface but it is still not good if it happens suddenly.


One thing about your BC is that it is a buoyancy compensator. It should be used to keep you from descending uncontrolled. Getting out of control on an ascent may be the result of being over weighted and having too much air in the BC but the real cause is not gear related. It is skills related. A diver needs to be keenly aware of what is going on with them and their equipment. I like to get in a realtively safe environment and practice ascents with my eyes closed. I began doing this using a line or rope so that I could grab it if need be. But now I rely on my body to tell me when to vent and to slow down. It will tell you in no uncertain terms if you listen to it. The key early on for me was to see just how slow I could make an ascent. And as long as your NDL's or air supply is not a factor new divers should forget the cameras, leave the fish ID slates at home, and work on slowing your ascents with your buddy.


The next thing is to get rid of the idea that holding your breath to arrest or start an ascent is a good thing. That's what the BC is for. I use breath control to change postion in the water column and to put me where I want to be. But it is not breath holding. It is breath control. What is controlled is the volume I take in and the rate at which I take it in and let it out.

I'm swimming along and there is something I want to go over. I may have been using a 5 count in 5 count out pattern to stay horizontal. And that pumps my lungs up ok. That now gets changed to a 6 or 7 in that really fills them and as I begin to gain some altitude as it were, I start to exhale for 5 -6 at a slower rate out of the reg and then go back to my normal rate - adjusting the air in the BC if necessary. As a new diver your goal should not be the least amount of air in the BC. The goal should be the right amount - for you - in the BC. Least amount comes with experience. If you are that negative and worried about to much air in the bc wear a little more neoprene to help you be just a bit more towards neutral at the surface.
 
definitely use your BCD, it is buoyance compensation device, put air into it to get neutual. You minumize air in BCD by properly weighted, NOT by being negative. The true is you can minimize air, but you can't eliminate it. Whether you like it or not, at the beginning of the dive, you BCD need to constain at least enouogh air to offset the weight of the gas in your tank, so that is ~6lb for 80cf tank, 8lb for 100cf tank.
 
Don't forget those long rubber things on the bottom of your feet. They are great for slowing your decent while you add air to the BC. They are also pretty helpful for beginning your ascent.

Keep that deflator in your hand while you go up so you can vent as you go up.

Get a computer if you don't have one. Mine beeps at me if I ascend too fast and has arrows on it I can monitor to see my ascent rate.
 
Don't be afraid to have a little bit of air in your BC! Like eelnoraa said, you are essentially offsetting the weight of the air in your full tank. You just have to pay a little more attention to how frequently you dump your air when you're ascending if you start with a little bit of air in your BC. I almost always have air in my BC since I frequently dive with extra weight that I can hand off to students. As long as you pay attention to your ascents you'll be fine! Breath control really is more for changes within the water column once you're already neutral, which you achieve roughly using your BC!

I'm guessing you don't have any extra weight on yourself, and it's just your body/tank that are making you negative... Other solutions: look at which fins you're using (mine are very negatively buoyant for example) and think about getting a slightly thicker suit (i don't know where you're diving... an extra mm might really help and wouldn't make you too uncomfortable).
 
James386 /Lynn,

Managing your buoyancy solely through lung volume manipulation is a fairly advanced skill so kudos for getting dialed in so soon. However it does sound like you may be taking it to an extreme. For the sake of enjoyable diving it's nice to have a natural relaxed breathing style. A few thoughts do come to mind.

1) You can stop breathing any time but you cannot hold your breath. That meaning your glottis must remain open so air can flow. When I was starting out I kept myself honest by softly moaning or groaning into the regulator when I paused my breathing as audible proof that my airway was open. Along the way that ended.

2) On descent you may want to be adding some BC air in small spurts, perhaps very few and small if your wetsuit is light and your weighting that precise. One thing I will tend to do is take a very deep breath as I approach the bottom and give the BC a shot of air as I exhale, trading one buoyancy source for another. You can can then enjoy deep relaxed efficient breathing. Your BC will require only slight adjustments as the cylinder depletes or when you make significant depth changes. There is no shame in letting your BC perform it's function. The goal is to stop horizontal and short of the bottom, like a bungee jumper, but not rebound up!

3) It sounds like you may be relying on your breathing to avoid an uncontrolled ascent. Divers in the vintage style will do this when operating in a pre-BC mode. the catch is that you may be in a situation where that level of breath control is not comfortable. You are better off being able to control your ascent while breathing normally. You do not state what your gear is but it may be negative providing some inherent "lead weight". It may also be that you are not truly negative when the cylinder is depleted. Ascending with a depleted cylinder is the defining moment for setting your weight if there is to be any. Your breathing is a great fine tuning tool but it should not be what separates you from corking. Here is a weight check method I like.

Pete
 

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