Atomic Z2x First Stage - To swivel or not?

[fdog]

As inferred by scubafanatic, the fact that your reg:

<snip> and it felt like it was trying to pull out of the one side of my mouth.

displays this behavior, in itself, tells you that hose length and/or mouthpiece selection is incorrect.

For example:

• Hose to short for your build: pulls on right side of mouth
• Hose too long: pulls on left side
• Hose way too long: pulls on right and twists clockwise

Everyone has a subtly different build in the shoulders, so the stock hose may not be right for you. This is a reason that LP hoses come in so many sizes.

Swivels, either at the second stage (and to a lessor extent, on the first) will give you a greater tolerance for incorrect hose lengths, and if the correct lengths are in place, a very "fine tuned" comfort.

Generally, good swivels are not free moving when pressurized; they have some "stiffness" that allows you to easily bend the reg into a comfortable position, where it stays nice and comfortable for the rest of the dive. A loose, floppy swivel can be a safety hazard, because it will allow the second to flail around willy-nilly, especially when donating or knocked out of the mouth, where retention of configuration is a good thing.


All the best, James

 

[Doubler]

Jerzi,
The swivel hose adds a ball adapter between the end of the hose and the regulator "allowing" the regulator free movement without moving the hose. The problem my spouse had with it was that it added more weight to the regulator, pulled down on her jaw, didn't swivel that well under pressure and it stuck way out there. I changed that hose out with a 22 inch Miflex and all those problems went away. The Miflex is extremely light and you don't know it is even there. On my last liveaboard trip one of the other divers was complaining about jaw fatigue. He had a swivel. I always travel with extra hoses so I hooked him up with a Miflex, jaw fatigue gone. Miflex comes in many different lengths. I am old school so I dive a short hose on my primary and a 4 footer on my Octopus. If you dive, as many do today, with the long hose on your primary Miflex has 48 and 72 inch hoses and a 18 and 22 that would be perfect for the neck bungee. I am waiting for a regulator company to make these hoses standard.

 

[RJP]

I am waiting for a regulator company to make these hoses standard.

AquaLung puts them on their Mikron line.

 

[driftdive]

Thanks for the replies and opinions! I decided to go without the first stage swivel and with the second stage swivel. My old Conshelf first stage has fewer ports than the Atomic and no swivel and that worked OK for me since 1984. The proof will be in the diving of course . . .

 

[Jerzi]

As inferred by scubafanatic, the fact that your reg:



displays this behavior, in itself, tells you that hose length and/or mouthpiece selection is incorrect.

For example:

• Hose to short for your build: pulls on right side of mouth
• Hose too long: pulls on left side
• Hose way too long: pulls on right and twists clockwise

Everyone has a subtly different build in the shoulders, so the stock hose may not be right for you. This is a reason that LP hoses come in so many sizes.

Swivels, either at the second stage (and to a lessor extent, on the first) will give you a greater tolerance for incorrect hose lengths, and if the correct lengths are in place, a very "fine tuned" comfort.

Generally, good swivels are not free moving when pressurized; they have some "stiffness" that allows you to easily bend the reg into a comfortable position, where it stays nice and comfortable for the rest of the dive. A loose, floppy swivel can be a safety hazard, because it will allow the second to flail around willy-nilly, especially when donating or knocked out of the mouth, where retention of configuration is a good thing.


All the best, James

I was thinking the hose was just overly stiff with it because I had no issues with the other regulators I tried with the same hose length. It wasn't a major thing, just something I noticed. Thanks for the tips

 

[scubafanatic]

....I have found that the 1st-stage swivel does allow some added flexibility with respect to hose routing...it doesn't make much difference on the 2nd-stage comfort level...but DOES help me with routing the hoses as they 'exit' the 1st-stage as the 1st-stage swivel provides some extra wriggle-room for me to route/manuever hoses around obstacles (BC aircells/BC shoulder elbows/dumps)....so there IS a useful point to the 1st-stage swivel.

 

[Scared Silly]

Thanks for the replies and opinions! I decided to go without the first stage swivel and with the second stage swivel. My old Conshelf first stage has fewer ports than the Atomic and no swivel and that worked OK for me since 1984. The proof will be in the diving of course . . .

The first stage swivel is nice but many do not have it. Much of how the hoses route will depend on where they are located on the ports. With 6 ports around the turret you should not have a problem. If you find you want a swivel port let me know I have one that I am selling.