Artificial Reefs

[archman]

An yet the same artificial reef protects the surrounding soft bottom by keeping shrimpers away.
FT

I'm sure the shrimpers LOVE you! Texas is quite sensitive to these folks, as they run the largest state fishery and bring in the most shrimp to the U.S.. They have to contend with T.E.D.'s, B.R.D.'s, buy-outs, hurricanes, and hypoxic zones already. Their lobby can and does have a say in messing with their remaining fishing zones.

Shrimpers are so good at what they do, they can snuggle a trawl within a few hundred feet of a submerged object without batting an eye. In shallow water they can get within 100 feet. It's oil rigs they can't stand... all that pipe strewn about gets messy.

I can't believe I took the shrimpers side... damn you Fredt!!

Oh, before I forget... soft sediment communities require MUCH larger forage areas than hard bottom ones. They are influenced both positively and negatively by adjacent hard substrate, dependent on many variables. Treat a soft sediment community like a plains habitat, very boring, highly productive, and the bigger critters need tons of "range". A great many species which aggregate on hard bottom (snapper, grunts, porgies) actually do their primary feeding out on the soft bottoms.

I can't belive I defended the soft bottom communities... damn you FredT!!

 

[FredT]

I'm sure the shrimpers LOVE you! Texas is quite sensitive to these folks, as they run the largest state fishery and bring in the most shrimp to the U.S.. They have to contend with T.E.D.'s, B.R.D.'s, buy-outs, hurricanes, and hypoxic zones already. Their lobby can and does have a say in messing with their remaining fishing zones.

Teds and BRDs are necessary simply because the economics of fixing what is actually wrong with the system would be "inconvenient" for the PTBs. It's much better to drive shrimpers out of business than take the political heat for the decades of poor resource management. Allowing condos on nesting beaches (not to mention allowing building on barrier islands AT ALL is insane) channelizing to dsecrease the nursery areas, I could go on but you get my drift. The hypoxic zones are caused by specific actions WE have taken! Fix the root cause even if it does mean some politicians have to get hung. I'll even donate the rope and help scout for oak trees!

Shrimpers will face their largest threat by aquacultured shrimp. Wild ones are a lot more expensive to catch, irrespective of my personal opinion. Shrimping is big business here, but it's dying as a commercial venture all along the coast as the farmed shrimp take over the markets and keep the prices depressed.

I can't believe I took the shrimpers side... damn you Fredt!!

Oh, before I forget... soft sediment communities require MUCH larger forage areas than hard bottom ones. They are influenced both positively and negatively by adjacent hard substrate, dependent on many variables. Treat a soft sediment community like a plains habitat, very boring, highly productive, and the bigger critters need tons of "range". A great many species which aggregate on hard bottom (snapper, grunts, porgies) actually do their primary feeding out on the soft bottoms.

I can't belive I defended the soft bottom communities... damn you FredT!!

Strange bedfellows, what?

I grew up on a plains habitat, and I do enjoy a "sand dive" almost as much as a reef dive. Lots of neat critters on sand once you learn how to "see" them. GoM Pogies are doomed anyway now that the east coast fishery has collapsed
and the ships moved south. Snapper is rebounding somewhat fromthe increases size limits and BRDs, and I now need to push adult redfish out of the way when hunting some rigs. The next threat to the gulf fisheries is going to be the jewfish as they recover across their range.

OTOH one or two "reef" structures per lease square will not adversly effect the amount of soft bottom out there, but the increase in predator fish biomass may require a species mix readjustment.

FT

 

[Genesis]

In many areas the Jewfish are already stripping everything they can get their mouth around.

We have some resident Jews here on a couple of wrecks that have turned what were productive marine habitat into a thing nearly devoid of swimming life.

 

[DennisS]

I have an opinion on artifical reefs....

When they are nautical in nature, like a boat wreck or intentionally sunken vessel, etc., I like them for their contribution to the marine seascape and especially as habitat for marine critters.

I DO NOT like tire reefs or other land based stuff that is dumped in the ocean. I have seen a tire reef here off California that was done in the 80s and it looks terrible, even after almost 20 years. I could easily still see the letters of the tire companies on the tires. They also had set pipes in various configurations on the sandy sea floor. This group did their "research project" without permission from state agencies and IMO just created a dump out there off Newport Beach. When I saw it, it was full of trash (large and small) that got trapped in the apparatus.

Let's not turn our ocean into the dump that so much of our land has become. Protect our oceans!

The tire reefs definitely didn't work. They've broken up and destroy the natural reef whenver there is a storm.

http://www.staugustine.com/stories/071403/sta_1667569.shtml

 

[Marvintpa]

I've seen a few artificial reef proposals that try to capitalize on funding/support from both fishermen and divers. Since neither of those groups particularly likes the other (can't fish where the divers are and can't dive where the fishermen are), how do they get along on the same wrecks when both were courted for support in the sinking?

 

[FredT]

Since neither of those groups particularly likes the other (can't fish where the divers are and can't dive where the fishermen are), how do they get along on the same wrecks when both were courted for support in the sinking?

We are polite. Those there first use the resource a few minutes, then move on to other structure. Divers will often inform the pole types what fish are there and where in the water column they are located.

FT

 

[paolov]

In many areas the Jewfish are already stripping everything they can get their mouth around.

We have some resident Jews here on a couple of wrecks that have turned what were productive marine habitat into a thing nearly devoid of swimming life.

would harvesting some or all of this Jewfishes help bring back the balance of swimming life?

paolov

 

[archman]

Ack no! Jewfish are one of the most endangered marine fish species on the planet! In fact they're on the "Red List" in imminent danger of extinction. You might as well shoot a great white shark, blue whale, or a manatee. They won't even reproduce 'til they get big enough.

I am curious as to what these "reef stripping" specimens are doing. Could you be more specific as to what they are doing to make the reefs "devoid of swimming life?" I was always under the impression that a healthy reef could be easily indicated by the PRESENCE of big groupers.

 

[subdude]

No one said anything about SPEARING jewfish. The word used was harvest. Might just be semantics but the last thing law abiding spear fishermen need is to be associated with the illegal harvest of jewfish.

To answer your questiuon Arch, jewfish eat all the groupers and snappers on a reef.

subdude

 

[FredT]

Ack no! Jewfish are one of the most endangered marine fish species on the planet! In fact they're on the "Red List" in imminent danger of extinction.

This does not sit well with the fact that EVERY structure suitable for them east of Mobile Bay has 1 to 50 of the beasts on it, and the fact that once they show up NOTHING else is there after a couple weeks. Even the juveniles of other species disappear.

As a controlled harvest selective removal by shaft (NOT hook and line!) is a probably a good thing. It's still a litte early to open them to the commercial folks. But then again that's just the opinion of an ocean engineer with a few thousand hours in the waters in question, not a NMF regulatory biologist that sits behind a desk in DC and reads "reports" form other NMF folks that may actually be on top of the water. Of course once ANY species is targeted for unrestricted harvest by the commercial fishing folks it's toast!

YMMV

FT