Almost out of air after descending against a strong current

[Zippsy]

Dan, as the OP stated, the boat did do a live drop for the guide who tied the mooring line. The captain had no problem calculating the current, exact location and ability of the guide. I guess theoretically, he could have done the same for every other diver but that would have taken half a day to maneuver the the 37m boat to a different distant from the wreck for the people who can descend faster or slower than each other. In between drops, he could also go pick up the people that missed the wreck because of the visibility. I am not sure that would be the better option though.

I can't compare the current to what you have experience with but it was very strong by local standards. Despite this, very experience tech divers, almost brand new recreational divers and everyone in between were fairly easily able to pull there way done to the wreck in about 3-4 minutes. I have lots of experience in both live drops in currents as well as mooring line dives and, if given the option, I would choose the mooring line just about every time. And I am a diver, not the captain.

 

[danvolker]

Dan, as the OP stated, the boat did do a live drop for the guide who tied the mooring line. The captain had no problem calculating the current, exact location and ability of the guide. I guess theoretically, he could have done the same for every other diver but that would have taken half a day to maneuver the the 37m boat to a different distant from the wreck for the people who can descend faster or slower than each other. In between drops, he could also go pick up the people that missed the wreck because of the visibility. I am not sure that would be the better option though.

I can't compare the current to what you have experience with but it was very strong by local standards. Despite this, very experience tech divers, almost brand new recreational divers and everyone in between were fairly easily able to pull there way done to the wreck in about 3-4 minutes. I have lots of experience in both live drops in currents as well as mooring line dives and, if given the option, I would choose the mooring line just about every time. And I am a diver, not the captain.

I suppose if you had 45 people diving off the 100ft boat, then there is a huge CF in getting them all in to the water in a timely fashion. As I mentioned, the sheer size of the vessel is not really relevant--Local Liveaboards like Shearwater ( of JASA) are great at doing drift drops to wrecks....but the dive boats I refer to in my "preaching" run no more than 22 divers most of the time...one boat I know of can run 27, but typically chooses not to go over 20 or 22 in order to maintain a feeling of luxury and comfort on the boat...

In regard to current...if in your spots you can pull down the line, without working to hard, your currents are extremely mild. Here in Palm Beach, it would be nearly impossible for most divers to pull down a line on most days of the year. And yet, our wreck diving is some of the easiest wreck diving you can find!

 

[phoenix31tt]

i dont know about wrecks.. but we drop dive onto reefs all the time an always hit our mark even in variable surface/bottom currents...

one question though.. the OP replied that the current was so strong that the line was almost horizontal.... how is that even possible if it was moored to the wreck and boat?

 

[Zippsy]

I do believe it was a bit of an exaggeration to point out that it was a strong current. As best I recall, the dive boat was on the surface. The wreck was at tied at about 18m and I may be badly estimating it but the may have been about 50-60m of line in between. My geometry is rusty but that should be something around a 20 degree angle. The OP can correct me with his estimate. Also, I just checked my computer log. It took me 4 minutes to descend on the first dive and 2.5 minutes for the second dive.

 

[danvolker]

<snip> As best I recall, the dive boat was on the surface.<snip>.

Which reminds me of a story.....Back around the early 90's, early Diving Pioneer Frank Hammett, was doing a dive on Juno Reef ( Palm Beach, Fl) off of a friend's private boat, a 26 footer.
They were in a big hurry to get in the water--to be first in to shoot some fish, and "someone" tied the anchor line off the stern of the boat....When they jumped in, the current was mild, and there was little wind.

Somewhere over the next 40 minutes or so, the current starts screaming, and the wind and waves pick up.....

Frank is on the return swim along the bottom, to get to the anchor line, when he sees several scuba tanks and some other gear, lying on the bottom. Frank, happy to get any free gear, begins grabbing up as many tanks as he can carry, thrilled with the bonanza he is now reaping.......He swims another 50 yards, and then sees some fool's boat on the bottom--he swims to it, wondering what he might find on it, but on closer approach, realizes it is the private boat they came on!!! He most likely said something to himself like : " As best I recall, the dive boat was on the surface"

Now as the bonanza has turned to utter dejection, he and his friends surface, acutely aware it is about 10 minutes before sundown, they are 3 miles from shore and heading north and OUT in a 3.5 mph current....and they will not succeed in swimming to shore....

The 5 heads stared at each other for a few minutes, and then one noticed a dive boat on the horizon....it was Norine Rouse....the marketing arch enemy of Frank's business....Frank was the Hunter/Killer spearfishing Dive Shop, Norine was one of the first Eco-Only shops, and she was known for giving a free dive trip to anyone that would donate a speargun to wrap around( destroy) a tree by her shop.

She pulls up, and suggests she will save them on one condition....that Frank quits spearfishing forever.....He raises his hand to swear this. They drop the guns at the spot...they all sink to the bottom....And Norine saves them....

Of course, Frank found the guns the next day, and his word lasted exactly one day

Moral of the story: anchoring might seem like a great way to go, but looks can be deceiving

 

[nimoh]

Which reminds me of a story.....Back around the early 90's, early Diving Pioneer Frank Hammett, was doing a dive on Juno Reef ( Palm Beach, Fl) off of a friend's private boat, a 26 footer.
They were in a big hurry to get in the water--to be first in to shoot some fish, and "someone" tied the anchor line off the stern of the boat....When they jumped in, the current was mild, and there was little wind.

Somewhere over the next 40 minutes or so, the current starts screaming, and the wind and waves pick up.....

Frank is on the return swim along the bottom, to get to the anchor line, when he sees several scuba tanks and some other gear, lying on the bottom. Frank, happy to get any free gear, begins grabbing up as many tanks as he can carry, thrilled with the bonanza he is now reaping.......He swims another 50 yards, and then sees some fool's boat on the bottom--he swims to it, wondering what he might find on it, but on closer approach, realizes it is the private boat they came on!!! He most likely said something to himself like : " As best I recall, the dive boat was on the surface"

Now as the bonanza has turned to utter dejection, he and his friends surface, acutely aware it is about 10 minutes before sundown, they are 3 miles from shore and heading north and OUT in a 3.5 mph current....and they will not succeed in swimming to shore....

The 5 heads stared at each other for a few minutes, and then one noticed a dive boat on the horizon....it was Norine Rouse....the marketing arch enemy of Frank's business....Frank was the Hunter/Killer spearfishing Dive Shop, Norine was one of the first Eco-Only shops, and she was known for giving a free dive trip to anyone that would donate a speargun to wrap around( destroy) a tree by her shop.

She pulls up, and suggests she will save them on one condition....that Frank quits spearfishing forever.....He raises his hand to swear this. They drop the guns at the spot...they all sink to the bottom....And Norine saves them....

Of course, Frank found the guns the next day, and his word lasted exactly one day

Moral of the story: anchoring might seem like a great way to go, but looks can be deceiving

seems to me that if you aren't going to leave anyone on the boat (as Frank did), anchoring is still the best option

 

[Doppler]

the OP replied that the current was so strong that the line was almost horizontal.... how is that even possible if it was moored to the wreck and boat?

A diver's perspective can be totally whacked on the way down a line with a bit of a current.

 

[krawlings]

Here is an article from my Blogg about a dive I did this last June
My dive on June 14th 2013

On the Miracle of Life wreck

On June 14th We (Clifton Hunter . Josh Goode. Jesica Brodnick) arrived in Pompano Beach .stopped for some breakfast. Then we got to South Florida Dive center and charter .We got there a little early , So we started to get our gear situated. Then we signed in paid our money. Know we were set .Just had to wait for the boat to be primed and asked to board..We get the word to board . The four of us loaded our gear and picked our spots on the boat (Black Pearl)​

​

The day was starting out great Temps in the low 80*s no clouds , And the boat was not going to be crowded . We started putting our gear together so that we would be ready when we arrived at the dive sight.
I get my gear all set up and put on my 3mm wet suit, Ahh now I am ready. As I was looking around taking in the sights ,I over heir The captain taking to one of the divers in the back of the boat . I here him call him John .My ears perk up and I get a little intrigued !! I asked the captain If that was John Chaterton he was taking to (knowing that John Chaterton frequents the South Florida Dive Headquarters )John Chaterton.
He replied yes ,he dive with us a lot , I am so stoked . I never thought I would ever get to meet him or even dive with him . Wow what a day !

​

The captain asked us to please find a seat . We are getting underway and we could move around once we have made our way farther out in the inland channel .The ride out was going to be a long enjoyable ride. We get out into open water , And the ride was so smooth . The Seas were flat (all day)

​

This was just the calm before the storm. Just gave me a false since everything being a BREEZE
Well we arrive at the dive sight. The dive master gears up to drop down and set the hook/anchor line to the wreck. he jumps in and disappears below the surface ,it's getting closer . A few minutes later the Dive master
pops back up he missed the wreck. He said he ran out of slack line to hook it to the wreck . So we circled back around after they pulled the line and mooring ball back in. He was going to drop back down again a little up currant of it to drift in to it . The line got hooked in , The captain gave every one the go ahead to gear up and jump in . I gear up and walk to the back of the boat and get in line to jump in .
Cliff , Jessica , Josh, John jump in ahead of me ,I jump in the currant stared to pull me away Josh reaches out to help me get to the line . I drop down the line to the 10' area and Jessica is clinging to the line with both arms . The currant is ripping. John signals to here if she was OK . She signals no , he signals thumbs up she shakes here head yes . Did I say that the currant was ripping? John reaches around here and down the line, I then fallowed and I to reached around here myself . This all should have been my sign that this dive was way out there form me to . But I moved on . My thought was that It will get better after I get down farther . Well I was PULLING my way down and holding on with BOTH HAND with all I had , Did I say the currant was ripping? I kept looking at my SPG and my computer checking my depth.time and air. My arms are really burning from all the exertion pulling down while the current is pulling me away from the line (I am like a flag on a flagpole in a 40 mile hr, wind ) I am all most to the point of calling the dive and heading up the line .But I look down and I just see a strobe light flashing (I am at 110' or so)I think it was John's light. I make the decision to go the rest of the way , I have 1900psi air ,steel LP95 I am breathing 29% Nitrox . I at least want to touch the deck . I pull a couple more times and I can see the dark outline of the ship. I finally reach the deck and the currant is know vary minimal .I swim around the deck for a couple minutes check my SPG and my computer .I am at my ascent pressure and I am pushing my NDL . I then signal Josh that I am ending my dive and ascending. Josh gets Cliffs attention and relays to him . .we all start our ascend.this where thing take a unexpected turn . We ( Josh , cliff, John in that order) are ascending hand over hand , I keep checking my depth , We are not getting any shallower ? We are staying at 90' not getting higher . The currant is still ripping . We reach the end of the line and the mooring ball had been pulled under the water and collapsed it in on it's self.We are still around 90' , there is no more line to the surface , Josh taps me on my arm and signals to let go (Well I was narced by this time I do not remember that ). here is the things going through my mine OOO SH*T , I know the only way to the surface is to free ascend . So I let go (by this time I have came up to 80' area)Just after I had let go I looked for Josh and Cliff . All I seen was bubbles, I am on my own Do to the unexpected ascent profile I had burned through most of my air . I was forced to remove the 3 minute safety stop. I then did a slow ascent to the surface ' I broke the surface and look over and the boat is only 50 yards away from me. Boat sees me and swings around down currant from me so as to board the boat with more ease .Josh ,Cliff and John surface about 75 to 100 yards down currant of were I surfaced. the boat swings around and picks them up All accounted for . We find out after all divers were picked up (6 divers total) that if they had waited for the DM to surface before letting divers to dive .The dive would have been aborted ,only half the divers on the boat did the dive , Us three , John and 2 tech dives did the dive Wow what a dive pushed my skills.

Miracle of Life wreck June 14 2013 - YouTube
​

 

[Mike]

This was just the calm before the storm. Just gave me a false since everything being a BREEZE
Well we arrive at the dive sight. The dive master gears up to drop down and set the hook/anchor line to the wreck. he jumps in and disappears below the surface ,it's getting closer . A few minutes later the Dive master
pops back up he missed the wreck. He said he ran out of slack line to hook it to the wreck . So we circled back around after they pulled the line and mooring ball back in. He was going to drop back down again a little up currant of it to drift in to it . The line got hooked in , The captain gave every one the go ahead to gear up and jump in . I gear up and walk to the back of the boat and get in line to jump in .
Cliff , Jessica , Josh, John jump in ahead of me ,I jump in the currant stared to pull me away Josh reaches out to help me get to the line . I drop down the line to the 10' area and Jessica is clinging to the line with both arms . The currant is ripping. John signals to here if she was OK . She signals no , he signals thumbs up she shakes here head yes . Did I say that the currant was ripping? John reaches around here and down the line, I then fallowed and I to reached around here myself . This all should have been my sign that this dive was way out there form me to . But I moved on . My thought was that It will get better after I get down farther . Well I was PULLING my way down and holding on with BOTH HAND with all I had , Did I say the currant was ripping? I kept looking at my SPG and my computer checking my depth.time and air. My arms are really burning from all the exertion pulling down while the current is pulling me away from the line (I am like a flag on a flagpole in a 40 mile hr, wind ) I am all most to the point of calling the dive and heading up the line .But I look down and I just see a strobe light flashing (I am at 110' or so)I think it was John's light. I make the decision to go the rest of the way , I have 1900psi air ,steel LP95 I am breathing 29% Nitrox . I at least want to touch the deck . I pull a couple more times and I can see the dark outline of the ship. I finally reach the deck and the currant is know vary minimal .I swim around the deck for a couple minutes check my SPG and my computer .I am at my ascent pressure and I am pushing my NDL . I then signal Josh that I am ending my dive and ascending. Josh gets Cliffs attention and relays to him . .we all start our ascend.this where thing take a unexpected turn . We ( Josh , cliff, John in that order) are ascending hand over hand , I keep checking my depth , We are not getting any shallower ? We are staying at 90' not getting higher . The currant is still ripping . We reach the end of the line and the mooring ball had been pulled under the water and collapsed it in on it's self.We are still around 90' , there is no more line to the surface , Josh taps me on my arm and signals to let go (Well I was narced by this time I do not remember that ). here is the things going through my mine OOO SH*T , I know the only way to the surface is to free ascend . So I let go (by this time I have came up to 80' area)Just after I had let go I looked for Josh and Cliff . All I seen was bubbles, I am on my own Do to the unexpected ascent profile I had burned through most of my air . I was forced to remove the 3 minute safety stop. I then did a slow ascent to the surface ' I broke the surface and look over and the boat is only 50 yards away from me. Boat sees me and swings around down currant from me so as to board the boat with more ease .Josh ,Cliff and John surface about 75 to 100 yards down currant of were I surfaced. the boat swings around and picks them up All accounted for . We find out after all divers were picked up (6 divers total) that if they had waited for the DM to surface before letting divers to dive .The dive would have been aborted ,only half the divers on the boat did the dive , Us three , John and 2 tech dives did the dive Wow what a dive pushed my skills.

Miracle of Life wreck June 14 2013 - YouTube
​

Woosies. Had you done a live drop with a talented captain your dive would have been totally different.



---------- Post added October 30th, 2013 at 01:25 PM ----------

A diver's perspective can be totally whacked on the way down a line with a bit of a current.

Yep, it also takes very little current to get you horizontal in the water column when holding a line, it's natural for the current to extend your body horizontally.

 

[Diver0001]

The Situation

Lessons Learned (so far)

• Check your gauges often, no matter what. I was focusing on the descent and was convinced everything was just dandy, so I didn't feel an urgency to do it. I also didn't want to fall behind the group. Regardless I should have made a point to check. It's good that I did check when I got off the line, though. It was on my mind, and I did it as soon as we were in a safe place. If I hadn't done that I might not be writing this [shuddering]. I'm considering getting getting air integration with my dive computer to give some redundancy and to make it easier to check more frequently.
• Currents pose special risks. I wasn't aware that an alternate could free flow from the pressure that the current puts on it. If I had been aware that it was a possibility, I would have checked on it frequently to make sure the purge valve wasn't facing straight forward. I would also have been more likely to notice a funny sound.
• When critically low on air you should begin sharing air immediately. Don't wait until you are out of air. Sharing air immediately gives you the ability to deal with a contingency that causes you to separate later for some reason.
• My buddy made the right choice to get the guide's attention. Otherwise we would have just ascended up the anchor line, and I would likely have run out of air, since I was running through it faster than I thought. (I was surprised to hear that I was already at 20 bar when I started sharing air with the guide). We have practiced sharing air before, but what if her back was turned or something was distracting her just as I ran out of air? I could easily have panicked, and we all know how that story ends [shuddering].
• If my wife hadn't been able to get the guide's attention right away, we should have ascended immediately instead of heading for the anchor line. Share air, grasp arms and go up slowly. No safety stop. Despite the current, deploy the SMB at the surface, not at depth, in order to avoid additional extra task loading while sharing air. I'm confident that the experienced and competent boat crew would have seen us at the surface with the SMB inflated, even after drifting.

I hope this helps others avoid this situation or deal with something similar in the future. I look forward to learning more from the comments.

BTW, we dove the same site again in a few hours. Great dive!

Sure sounds like you did a lot of stuff right.

Your lessons learned is good but from where I'm sitting the way you and your buddy handled it is a good example of what I call my ABCD rule. You did well and avoided the incident getting any worse. How you handled it was outstanding. Period!

That said, I would like to add to your lessons learned that gear configuration can make a difference to how sensitive your gear is to "unnoticed" gas loss in current. You've seen that your current configuration lends itself to this but there are configurations that would make unnoticed gas loss unlikely if not impossible.

I don't want to start a gear discussion but I will point out that a long-hose/bungee octopus configuration is not popular among wreck divers for no good reason. One of the things that makes this configuration superior (in my mind) is that you can't lose gas without being aware that it's happening.

R..