almost DIR reg setup with regular gear

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In two of the three situations where I have donated air in a real OOA situation, I got mugged for the primary. In the third air share, the diver had a cold water freeze flow at depth and we had already initiated an ascent since we knew the inevitable was close at hand. Consequently I had the reg ready to hand to him when his tank went dry.

So...in my opinion, training to donate the primary is the way to go and a long hose primary just makes a lot more sense especially with a panicked or potentially panicked diver. A 5 ft hose works great for most recreational divers although a 6 ft hose may be needed for divers with larger chests and BC's. A 7 ft hose is too much for a recreational diver as a conventional BC offers no place to tuck in the extra hose lenght. And given that there is never going to be a need for the divers to follow one another out in trail formation through a restriction, you really don't need the extra foot or two of hose.

One of the arguments that is often posed against a long hose (usually by those who have never used one) is that the gas sharing diver will not be close to you. That is not the case as keeping the diver close is always an option - all you have to do is hold BC's as you would do when air sharing with a short hose. The difference is that the OOA diver is not forced to remain close to you out of fear of losing the reg, and fear of any sort is not ideal with a panicking OOA diver and for an about to panic OOA diver it can be enough to push them over the edge.

The advantage of the long hose is not so much that you can swim farther apart, (although this is an option and can make it much more practical to do what amounts to a preemptive gas share while swimming back to the exit point, preventing an ascent in mid water where currents, etc may complicate the exit and allows the near OOA diver to presrve a few hundred psi for an indepndent ascent or safety stop and BC power inflate), the big advantage is that the long hose will not be tugging on the donated second stage and induce the feeling that it is about to be yanked from the OOA diver's mouth. It also doesn't have a sharp in bend in the hose due to having to do a 180 degree turn between the two divers involved and does not have to be held in the mouth by hand.

The use of a bungee for the octo is another issue. The idea in technical circles is to allow the diver to access his own redundant second stage without the use of hands in a cave, wreck or other restriction. It really is not critical to the long hose philosophy as applied to a recreation a setting. As long as a diver can access his or her octo clipped in a normal location in a normal fasion, there is no need for the bungee. Skipping the bungee eliminates the other major critisims of having a long hose in a recreational setting:

1. The potential interference between bungee and snorkel (not found on technical divers)

2. What happens when the OOA recreational diver does not mug you for the primary but instead grabs the bungeed octo. (it really depneds on how the bungee is secured to the mouth piece, it is securted with a loop around the mouthpiece the reg just pulls free, if it is secured under the zip tie securing the mouthpiece, it can get interesting.)

In my opinion, the ideal recreational configuration is a 5 ft or 6 ft long hose primary with a 32" to 40" octo secured in a normal manner. It covers all the bases, works regardless of how the receiving OOA diver was trained, works ideally in the most encountered situation where the OOA diver takes the primary and allows you more options in situations where more options are nice to have. (exits in areas of strong currents and in surf conditions where exiting along the bottom may be preferrable to a surface exit.) And it does not interfere with snorkel use.
 
You can certainly put one regulator, on the shorter hose, on a bungie around your neck, and use the longer hose as your primary, with the intent to donate it. The 36" or 40" hose that is standard for octos routes under the arm and to your mouth -- The problem is that it can tend to torque the reg a bit. I know my husband finds it necessary to put a swivel on his second stage to have it sit comfortably.

This problem is obviated by the use of the 5' hose, which also routes quite nicely under the arm and around the back of the neck. This configuration is easily used with standard BCs.

Compared with DA Aquamaster, I am a complete novice at this sport, but I really like having my secondary hanging directly under my chin. In the occasions where I have needed it (and there have been a couple), it's been very comforting that it's right there, and I don't have to fumble for it at all.
 
I would argue for the bungeed second just because lot's of time I'm seeing people with flowing octo around them or drugging one at the bottom. Saying that it's making life easer when dealing with people trained the "padi" way is right but it's making us dependable of the system not changing the one. anyway thanks for the reply.
 
I've been diving my regs that way for a while, and won't entertain the possibility of going back. I rented some gear on a trip earlier this month, and regretted not bringing mine on the trip. I haven't had to use reg keepers and put gauges in pockets since sometime in the mid 90s, and don't miss it. I will second the motion to mount the necklace in a manner that will allow the second to to pull free if someone goes for it.
Cheers----Chris
 
My LDS teaches this as the "normal" config, with a few dives during the open water class also made with the "classic rental" setup, so people can try them both and be prepared to deal with the typical vacation rental gear...

I just bought my first reg (in about 10 years) and I had them do this setup:

Atomic Z2 first stage
Atomic Z2 second stage on slightly longer than standard length hose to be my primary, which I will give away if needed
Atomic Z1 second stage on slightly shorter than standard length hose w/ necklace to be "MINE!" if I need to share air
(plus Aeris Atmos2 console)

This is clearly "DIR inspired" but not "true DIR". I've talked to all the instructors at my LDS (who are all DIR divers when its appropriate), and I've done a LOT of research, and the DIR approach is clearly a good idea (to at least checkout) if you are tech, cave, or wreck diving, but is likely overkill or not appropiate for some more "sport" kinds of diving.

The original justification for the very very long hose on the donated 2nd stage was to accomodate two divers proceeding one after the other through tiny cave openings, by the way.

By the way, the creator of DIR often dove "recreation style" for open water sport diving, reserving DIR for his extensive caving. It was only after his death (trying to rescue another diver) that DIR really picked up steam as a religion...

So, my plan is to take the best of DIR, sport and experience to create a system that works for me (and my buddy), without worrying about being "true DIR".

I mean, I once overheard a 45 minute argument between two DIR divers about whether or not colored wetsuit gloves or fins other than JetFin-style were "allowed" in DIR.
 
So what are the advantages of donating your octopus instead of your primary in an OOA situation?

The last 2 times I've done a practice OOA situation with divers who donate their octos and weren't expecting the OOA (i.e. we weren't kneeling on a platform with the octo in the other diver's hand, ready to give it to me), it took waaay too long for the buddy to find the octo and give it to me. By the time I got the donated octopus, I would have probably already, by instinct, ripped the primary out of my buddy's mouth because it took so darn long.

Buddies who have donated me their primary regs in the same situations have done so promptly. Does this say something about donating an octo or do I need to do a better job of chosing who I dive with?

btw, Tep I have the same attitude about DIR.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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