Sas
Contributor
Is the equipment you have listed the only BC setups you have tried? What did you use with the Draeger Dolphin?
Advanced Recreational Cavern/Cave Diving?
- Thread starter MauiScubaSteve
- Start date
Please register or login
Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.
Benefits of registering include
- Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
- A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
- You can make this box go away
halemanō;5210133:
It's a pretty interesting setup, but I think it's a bit pricey. If you have a chance, take a look at the videos on his site.
There are places in overhead environments where you are going to scrape or wiggle through, and contact with the ceiling or the walls is unavoidable. Damage to your buoyancy compensator is a possibility, so we train for what to do if that happens, and we dive redundant buoyancy.
The main reason for a backplate setup for such situations is to have double tanks -- my personal opinion is that no one has any business in a single file restriction without their own redundancy, but your risk tolerance may (and does) vary from mine, and from the judgments of the majority of the cave diving community. The backplate is not because it's optimal for restrictions -- no gear is, probably, because restrictions vary in their shape and where the tightest dimension is. It's because most of us think it's wise to have our own backups, should something go wrong in the middle of wiggling through a section like that.
My Cave 2 training involved a lot of thinking about what to do, if things go wrong in restricted passage. I didn't always (or even often) do very well with handling the issues that were thrown at us in that class. What it taught me is that restricted passage is more complicated than just how to get yourself, or your gear, through; it's thinking through what you are going to do if someone gets stuck, or has a gas problem, or loses their composure in the middle of such a passage. It requires a great deal of calm and rational thinking to salvage things when they go wrong there.
It's incredibly attractive to wiggle through a hole like the one in the photographs, to see what is on the other side. The answer can be ugly.
The main reason for a backplate setup for such situations is to have double tanks -- my personal opinion is that no one has any business in a single file restriction without their own redundancy, but your risk tolerance may (and does) vary from mine, and from the judgments of the majority of the cave diving community. The backplate is not because it's optimal for restrictions -- no gear is, probably, because restrictions vary in their shape and where the tightest dimension is. It's because most of us think it's wise to have our own backups, should something go wrong in the middle of wiggling through a section like that.
My Cave 2 training involved a lot of thinking about what to do, if things go wrong in restricted passage. I didn't always (or even often) do very well with handling the issues that were thrown at us in that class. What it taught me is that restricted passage is more complicated than just how to get yourself, or your gear, through; it's thinking through what you are going to do if someone gets stuck, or has a gas problem, or loses their composure in the middle of such a passage. It requires a great deal of calm and rational thinking to salvage things when they go wrong there.
It's incredibly attractive to wiggle through a hole like the one in the photographs, to see what is on the other side. The answer can be ugly.
OP
I have used various warm water rental vests; SP Classic Sport (?adjustable shoulder straps), AL Wave, SQ Pro QD, most Oceanic vests circa '04.
I have absolutely no interest in deco diving, so no interest in doubles diving. I am located in a region where I am surrounded by vest BC's. My total expenditures on the previously posted BC quiver is $430; $450 counting the Balance. If I spend any money on diving in the near future it will be three "old" Apollo/Dacor scooters.
You seem to be implying that I should not be asking questions unless I know the answer?
Sas
Contributor
halemanō;5210217:
Why do you think you can comment on BP/Ws then?
You seem to be implying that I should not be asking questions unless I know the answer?
I am implying you should stick to giving opinions about things you've actually used.
OP
Part of the OP dealt with the fact that I/we know what is on the other side; we have been there before. I have been through this lava tube numerous times solo, and beanniebrew has been through many nearly as tight tubes with me over our +5 years of diving together. She followed me through this lava tube going the other direction a couple weeks ago.
As stated by spoolin01, there are no forks in the tube; keep moving forward and you will get out. It is also not pitch black; after a couple minutes the glow of the skylights ahead and the entrance behind will provide enough light even if both our main lights fail. We have pockets, so why does anyone think we do not have a backup.
halemanō;5209499:
Excuse me but I'm still very confused about this whole thread. Halemano apparently is writing that for these particular tubes, a jacket BC is preferable to a back inflate BC of whatever kind. From what I understand (and I admit I may not be understanding it) he believes the jacket BC is preferable because the air bladder won't get caught on anything while a back inflate type may (will?) get caught/cut because it is on one's back.
Now I don't dive a jacket BC and haven't for years -- but it seems to me the air bladder also goes on one's back and isn't all that much different from the size of the bladder on a back inflate. (Wait a minute -- I'm going downstairs to check --- back in a moment -- I'm back.)
YES -- experimental evidence proves that a jacket BC has a bladder on the BACK of the BC -- just like a Back Inflate BC. Both bladders appear to be on both sides of the tank.
OK -- now what is the issue?
Now I don't dive a jacket BC and haven't for years -- but it seems to me the air bladder also goes on one's back and isn't all that much different from the size of the bladder on a back inflate. (Wait a minute -- I'm going downstairs to check --- back in a moment -- I'm back.)
YES -- experimental evidence proves that a jacket BC has a bladder on the BACK of the BC -- just like a Back Inflate BC. Both bladders appear to be on both sides of the tank.
OK -- now what is the issue?
halemanō;5210245:
I somewhat gave you the benefit of the doubt. I didnt say you didnt have them, just that they weren't apparent in the pics.
Since you mention carrying them in a pocket, I would question how that would work out if you're in that tight of a restriction when your light fails. Could you reach into your pocket and remove it?
Most of what you're describing sounds like it's outside where my personal comfort zone would be and it's not something I'd advocate for others. But if it works for you, more power to you.
SuPrBuGmAn
Contributor
One... that ain't that tight.
Two... you're doing a cavern dive, which typically is open to mostly recreational gear(aside from a couple lights and a long hose).
Three... you're bouyancy and propulsion methods suck. This might work for your rocky bottomed lava tube, but its not gonna cut it in any cavern with silt.
Four... a BP/W setup isn't gonna be clutter below you, so you'll be able to get a bit lower, freeing up some of that vertical space. A proper wing isn't gonna taco into side-scraping oblivion. You obviously don't know about BP/Ws and obviously just want to convince yourself and others that your garage sale jacket BCs are ideal(they are fine for a cavern dive, not ideal by any means).
Five... this reply doesn't matter, because you already knew all YOUR answers before ever posting anything in the first place.
Six... The BC issue is the least problematic issue in your entire scenario.
Two... you're doing a cavern dive, which typically is open to mostly recreational gear(aside from a couple lights and a long hose).
Three... you're bouyancy and propulsion methods suck. This might work for your rocky bottomed lava tube, but its not gonna cut it in any cavern with silt.
Four... a BP/W setup isn't gonna be clutter below you, so you'll be able to get a bit lower, freeing up some of that vertical space. A proper wing isn't gonna taco into side-scraping oblivion. You obviously don't know about BP/Ws and obviously just want to convince yourself and others that your garage sale jacket BCs are ideal(they are fine for a cavern dive, not ideal by any means).
Five... this reply doesn't matter, because you already knew all YOUR answers before ever posting anything in the first place.
Six... The BC issue is the least problematic issue in your entire scenario.
UCFKnightDiver
Contributor
Wow, those pictures are scary, hope you don't have any problems in there...
Similar threads
- Suggestion
