Advanced penetration of the Spiegel Grove Wreck

[Coztick]

He may know how, but he clearly stated he doesn't want to waste his time doing it. His gas planning is based on experience: he did the dive once before, so it is OK to do it again. That is not gas planning, of course; that is just trusting in dumb luck.

Sooo, a "test dive" is NOT appropriate gas planning??
What if you go slow??

Sorry, I'm a sarcastic ass!

 

[Coztick]

as frequent as this

Certainly not that frequently but the numbers are probably pretty close.
You get we're talking about people right?
Not the OP, he's done this dozens of times. He's good?
My concern is the two trusting him.

 

[Celt]

Certainly not that frequently but the numbers are probably pretty close.
You get we're talking about people right?
Not the OP, he's done this dozens of times. He's good?
My concern is the two trusting him.

Relax no one plans a wreck dive on an Internet forum. As least not an adult.

 

[happy-diver]

Here ya go! I edited the original video after I filmed it so it's not continuous but it gives you a general idea.

So here's the video page 8

OK, I just looked at the video. This dive is not nearly as serious as described.

and here's the summary page 12



and yet the basic diver forever incensed crowd, just keep on talking and talking and talking


Hey how's that music in the video, it's pretty majestic yeah, far more majestic than the dive

You did watch the video folks

 

[Manatee Diver]

Relax no one plans a wreck dive on an Internet forum. As least not an adult.

I actually do the initial planning for a lot of my cave dives on the internet.

I research new places, watch videos, and take advice. The final planning is done in the water as we do gas matching and go over the plan one last time.

This planning as saved me time, there is a tunnel that I saw on the map, went and saw some videos on the internet and I didn't have confidence that one of my primary buddies (a BM CCR diver) and I could navigate it safely. Off to a different tunnel for that weekend.

 

[ChuckP]

So here's the video page 8




and here's the summary page 12



and yet the basic diver forever incensed crowd, just keep on talking and talking and talking


Hey how's that music in the video, it's pretty majestic yeah, far more majestic than the dive

You did watch the video folks

It is a pretty mundane dive, no where near what the "plan" describes but it wasn't till page 8 that you see a video of the dive and by then, the attitude was already well in place.

It stops being mundane when:
A low pressure hose fails in the passageway
Someone's low on gas
Someone's narced and decides to wander
Someone's overly nervous
Someone's entangled in the line
He calls it an advanced penetration
He talks about on the fly possibly going down staircases and exploring
He doesn't want the captain to know about his plans
Most if not all dive ops would require wreck training for that dive, and who knows, maybe even advanced if you were going to wander about

The cavalier attitude is a big turn off, a huge warning sign. Even a long swim thru like that "penetration" has potential for big problems for untrained folks - problems cascade and then your name turns up on a google search. It's not many pages into the divemaster training that divers like this are pointed out.....

Why not get the wreck training, have a guide and leave the reel on the boat?

 

[Storker]

Why not get the wreck training, have a guide and leave the reel on the boat?

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

FYI: The OP has been banned. Per SB policy, the reason will never be disclosed.

However, I would like to suggest that if we want to continue the discussion, it should be based on more general principles, not by replying directly to the OP.

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[Hoag]

So, here we are 18 pages into the thread.

I am not a tech diver. I am not a wreck diver. When I am on a wreck, I limit myself to swim throughs with a clear unobstructed exit. I have only dove the SG twice, and at that time, she was still resting on her side so you know it was "a few" years ago.

Having said that, as I was reading the last 18 pages, I couldn't help but think of a phenomenon known as the "Dunning-Kruger Effect" which according to Wikipedia (ya I know it isn't the best reference, but it'll do here) "... is a cognitive bias in which people with low ability at a task overestimate their ability. It is related to the cognitive bias of illusory superiority and comes from the inability of people to recognize their lack of ability. Without the self-awareness ... people cannot objectively evaluate their competence or incompetence."

It is often expressed as a graph:

This thread seems to have had contributors from across pretty much the entire spectrum from None to guru.

 

[ChuckP]

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A ScubaBoard Staff Message...

FYI: The OP has been banned. Per SB policy, the reason will never be disclosed.

However, I would like to suggest that if we want to continue the discussion, it should be based on more general principles, not by replying directly to the OP.

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I wasn't replying to the OP - I was replying to the guy that didn't like that folks suggesting that his plan wasn't a good idea

 

[jadairiii]

....

You did watch the video folks

To reiterate ChuckP's post, a blown lp/hp hose or even a free-flowing reg in side there with inexperienced divers and it goes from zero to Sh*t Show in a heart beat. Good luck handing off your Octo on a standard hose and getting the diver out without incident. There actually is a valid reason for a 7' primary hose.