A little help with Nitrox, please...

[grazie42]

Sharpenu once bubbled: I pay $1200 to go on a trip. We are there for 4 diving days and do 15 dives of an average 40 mins each. That is 600 minutes of diving time, or $2 per minute. Even if I only add 6 minutes to the average bottom time by diving nitrox for $8 each day. That adds $32 to the trip. Now I dive 690 minutes for $1232 or $1.78 per minute. Just made each dive cheaper, didn't I?

Play around with any set of numbers a bit and you can get almost any answer you want (I´m not disputing yours). I will say that your Nitrox came pretty cheap (or maybe you just did 2 dives/day on Nitrox?)

Anyways...without to aggressive a profile you can still get in 4 dives/day on air for 6 days. After a deep dive I like to add one on Nitrox with that kind of profile or just if I had a challenging dive, not just to help with NDL or to get rid of Nitrogen but because it makes me feel fresher and sharper during/after the dives. To me, more then one a day, doesent feel worth it (and I wont do 1 every day either) but maybe thats just me.

 

[jagfish]

Just imagine your dilemma if you were paying 28 bucks a nitrox fill like you can sometimes here...

JAG

 

[grazie42]

At 28$ / fill I wouldn´t "pay for it", I´d skip diving nitrox...
Also I´ve only done nitrox "at home" during the course I took to get the cert.
We don´t generally do more then 2 dives/day here and so there´s really no point...
Still...I think its about 10$ a fill here and that certainly has something to do with it...

 

[jagfish]

Yup
That's why I don't dive nitrox in Japan (mainland anyway). Okinawa is more in line with prices in the US.

JAG

 

[roni]

The big benefit of diving Nitrox is NOT the extended dive time; the reality is most diver do not have sufficiently good air consumption to utilized the extended dive duration. The real benefit is reduce fatigue in the end of day of diving, and reduce chance for DCS. I dive nitrox only, and so is the case with all my dive masters and instructors, and if you will ask any of them why they dive it, they will tell you that it is because they feel better after a day of diving.

3 years ago I worked as dive instructor in Club Med Turks & Ciacos. This is a huge dive operation with quit often having 100 diver plus a day, it is/ was (no idea how it is now) extremely safe dive operation, the dive boat were equipped with 4 emergency regulators in 20 feet, plenty of O2, hyperbaric doctor on board, and very conservative dive policies. With all this, every month the Club Med dive center would have DCS cases. Looking on the profiles of this divers, most of this divers done every thing correctly. DCS does happen.

In regarded to Nitrox price, we charge our divers $100 per week or $10 per tank of 32%, $12 per 36%

Roni Liberman
Protech Belize www.protechbelize.com
IANTD Trimix Instructor Trainer Trainer (ITT)
PADI Gold Palm 5 Stars IDC center

 

[glbirch]

The real benefit is reduce fatigue in the end of day of diving, and reduce chance for DCS. I dive nitrox only, and so is the case with all my dive masters and instructors, and if you will ask any of them why they dive it, they will tell you that it is because they feel better after a day of diving.

I've heard this theory before. I would be interested in seeing some emperical data supporting the theory that diving Nitrox reduces fatigue.

 

[DandyDon]

The big benefit of diving Nitrox is NOT the extended dive time; the reality is most diver do not have sufficiently good air consumption to utilized the extended dive duration.

If I'm diving to around 80 feet, I would agree, and not bother with Nx unless I was on the $100 a week plan; if I was, I'd go 36% as the extra O2 in the tank/less N2 loading does help theoretically and anecdoately.

On the other hand, the dives where I really want Nx, even if $20 a tank, are the 100+ feet dives, like on Florida Keys and North Carolina wrecks. I guess my gas use is about average, and at those depths, I am certainly going to hit N2 limits before I run out of Air if I'm on 21% Air, even on a 80 cf tank, but actually - I'm more likely to be on a 100 cf tank, as I know where to rent them - with 32%, 30%, or 28%, depending on the plan.

The real benefit is reduce fatigue in the end of day of diving...

This has never been proven, to my knowledge, but I said "extra O2 in the tank/less N2 loading does help theoretically and anecdoately" as I often hear this, and it makes since to me that if my blood loads up on less N2, then it'll carry more 02, reducing fatigue. Afterall, one sympton of subclinical DCS is fatigue. Since the resort offers $100 a week Nx, that's a good deal I'd go for.

...and reduce chance for DCS.

Studies indicate that DCS is so rare, that using N2 to protect against it is actually not logical, if the diving is done within recreational limits, except...

...every month the Club Med dive center would have DCS cases.

In a way, this contradicts your statement of "The big benefit of diving Nitrox is NOT the extended dive time..." I've never been to a CM, but from what I've heard of them, I'd suspect the real culprit would be dehyration from alcoholic consumption the night before.

Yet, while I do not fully agree with your statements, I'll still agree that it'll help at least some in all areas, so if you can get it for $100 a week, do it!

I'll be your customer next week, Roni. If you'll give me Nx for $100 a week, I want 15 tanks. If I have to pay $14 a tank, though, I want 6. What do ya' say...?

I am not complaining about your rates, as I doubt that you're getting rich on them. I'm sure it's costly to get O2 there. It's simply a consumer decision.

 

[Don Burke]

The big benefit of diving Nitrox is NOT the extended dive time; the reality is most diver do not have sufficiently good air consumption to utilized the extended dive duration.

Perhaps a steady diet of thirty foot dives would work out that way, but many divers can make two dives to ninety feet using air from a single eighty for each and won't be able to use all of the second tank.

The reality is that most of the nitrox tanks around here are larger tanks, as large as one hundred thirty one cubic feet. I don't see all that many EAN labeled eighties around here. Actually,I think I own a significant portion of the ones within thirty miles or so.

You can put a one twenty five on nearly anyone and they will go for longer bottom times.

 

[DandyDon]

I'll be your customer next week, Roni. If you'll give me Nx for $100 a week, I want 15 tanks. If I have to pay $14 a tank, though, I want 6. What do ya' say...?

I am not complaining about your rates, as I doubt that you're getting rich on them. I'm sure it's costly to get O2 there. It's simply a consumer decision.

Really - if you'll give us $100 a week, I bet I can get you a lot more sales out of our group...:01zz:

 

[roni]

I've heard this theory before. I would be interested in seeing some emperical data supporting the theory that diving Nitrox reduces fatigue.

I am not aware of any research on the subject, but as I teach 10 to 20 nitrox student a month, I can tell you that majority of them say that they feel less tired.

In regards to explanation of why you feel less tired; any time you going diving your tissue is loading up with Nitrogen, in the end of a normal dive the size of the nitrogen bubble is to small to cause a DCS. However, the nitrogen loading in the tissue is not part of our normal physics, and your buddy immune system is becoming active in a attempt to combat the nitrogen. This is what cause the fating in the end of day of diving, after all, diving is definitely not an aerobics activity. When you dive Nitrox the Nitrogen loading in the tissue is less, and the body spend less reduce in fighting.