3 sides to photography

[BradfordD]

Thanks Blacknet, this is a very good thread!

I agree that this "U/W Photography" forum is based more on equipment than on anything else... But, for that matter, the whole scubaboard.com appears to be more equipment/location related, insofar as the activity of the forums are concerned...

I also agree that while the majority of the postings here are to ask questions about the "latest and greatest" underwater photo gear - there has been scant little on the other aspects of U/W photography and on photography in general..

You have brought up very good points about artistry and blending of technique and artistic ability to produce that "perfect" shot, and there is NO WAY that this can be accomplished solely by good gear....

However, as this is primarily a spot to receive reviews of U/W photo gear, maybe you as well as a lot of us other guys (to which I count myself) should seek out other forums that speak more to the other aspects of photography and U/W photography in particular. The problem appears to be (for me anyway) that there just aren't other forum sites that cater to U/W photography.

Having said all this (and please forgive me for rambling)... How about if we try to integrate a "Critique" type thread here... One that speaks more to the artistry and technique of the shot, than just the photo gear?

This reply is not meant to rant or flame.... so no wars, please!

 

[Rooster]

blacknet once bubbled...
Hello,

Well first off don't get me wrong. I see 9/10 posts on hardware and very little on #2 and #3. hardware is good, we need it and need to learn it, lets just not beat a dead horse

Scuba Jim, Lets start by doing good critiques on photo's that's posted here. Lets give feedback on all aspects and maybe we can get the group to move to #2 and #3. I also think it may actually bring in more photographers. I know several who doesn't like to hear all equipment talk.

Ed

First let me say that I occasional come here because I feel that everyone is welcome. You can post what ever they want, (with in reason), on this forum. I for one like the tone or flavor of this forum the way it is. The topics that are posted here (yes mostly equipment) are posted because that's what most want to discuss. If you feel it's beating a dead horse don't read the threads. Saying what "WE" need to learn, or what direction the group needs to go, is IMHO a little presumptuous. There are already several other forums dedicated to the type of topics you think "WE" should be discussing here. When I want that type on discussion or information I go elsewhere. I for one feel it's a little offensive to offer criticism of ones photos, even if you think it's constructive, unless it was specifically asked for. Most people post photos here because they want to share, not because they want someone to critique their work. Unsolicited "FEEDBACK" may move the "discussions" to, #2 and #3, but you will not move the "group" as it is. You will alienate many of those that come here to chat about UW photography, post a few pic's, or look at what others have posted. If you want a different type of forum than what this one is, perhaps you should start a new one. Of course, this is just my opinion. Your actual mileage may (and probably will) vary.

 

[Dee]

I like the 'feel' of this forum, that's why I spend so much time here. I know I am welcome here and I don't feel out of place, as with some forums.

Like Rooster, I'm not comfortable critiquing someones photos unless expressly asked to do so. I think that's one reason more people don't post their photo's...fear of them 'not being good enough', which I hear very often and that is a shame.

For those members who like to discuss the very technical aspects of photography, go to one of the message boards that specialize in that type of atmosphere...like Wet Pixel or parts of Digital Diver. If you'd like a critique of your photos, just ask for one. Or better yet, PM or email a photographer you respect and ask their opinion. I think you'll get a more honest answer.

I'd much rather see a beginning photographer start posting their photos and watch them grow and improve as time goes by, celebrating their hobby with them, rather than have them too intimidated to ask questions or show their work, as you see on other forums. Even though answering the same "What camera should I buy?" questions over and over gets tiresome, I'm glad people are comfortable enough to ask them. I hope that doesn't change.

This just my 2¢

 

[Scuba Jim]

wants to critique my pickies. After all, I think a lot of people post images here simply because they want someone to say "That's nice" (though I expect they would prefer them not to say "That's bad!"

So, to start the ball rolling, please rip this one to pieces!!!!

Arf Arf!

 

[Bacchus]

I've been posting here for a few months now. Originally in the "travel" section, but more recently in the u/w photo threads. I'm new to the u/w photo scene and have really enjoyed the "feel" of it here.

Yes, I do visit other sites that specialize in the more technical and artistic side of photography, but like many others on those sites I "lurk" and don't post much. For those who know me, I'm not a shy person, I have thick skin but still want to have something valuable to contribute to a conversation. Maybe in time I will feel more at ease posting in more tech/artistic sites. When I want that, I can always go there!

I have no problem with others critiquing my shots, but I generally post here to share the common experience.

Just my thoughts.

Steve

 

[blacknet]

Hello,

A critique is a very useful tool. It helps us figure out what we need to work on, how the public views it, how others views it and makes sure we are on track.

Now if someone said things like "it sucks" that's not constructive at all and doesn't help any. I think that most people who post photo's would appreciate constructive feedback for various reasons.

The run of the mill dive shop will have you out taking millions of crap images and have little results to show from it. I think this is the wrong approach to take and we should be studying the works of great people like ansel adams and the like. Education thru mass production is not a good quality education.

Also those other boards that Dee mentioned caters mostly to the digital side of the house. There are those of us who shoot film and will not be switching to digital anytime in the near future.

Ed

 

[Cecil]

Good thread and worth talking about and does not normally happen. Thanks, Ed for starting it.

Jim did ask us to critique his photo, so here goes. I think its sucks, because it was probably taken off Tahiti and he didn't take me.

Really nice picture, good composition and not something you normally see. One think you could do is make it bigger, normal for posting is 640x480 pixels.

 

[Dee]

Ed....Wetpixel still has a very active film section. It also has forums for video, housed digital SLR's, and dedicated u/w digitals.

It doesn't cater mostly to digital at all, that's why I included it.

 

[Scuba Jim]

Sorry Cecil, you're wrong!

It was taken at Observation Point in Papua New Guinea!

If you look closely you can see his home behind him. It's an old spam tin!

Size wise, I just dug it out of my "files" and couldn't be bothered to do a rescan, I am afraid!

And Ed, you're right, I have no plans to switch to digital. It's fine for the web and fine for making prints perhaps 10 x 7 inches, but you can't make a 200 megabyte hi res scan of a digipic and enlarge a 2-inch seahorse up so it is 6ft tall!!!!

 

[Rooster]

blacknet once bubbled...
Hello,

A critique is a very useful tool. It helps us figure out what we need to work on, how the public views it, how others views it and makes sure we are on track.

Yes I know what a critique is. Perhaps you should critique your own posts so you can "figure out what we need to work on, how the public views it, how others views it and makes sure we are on track"

Now if someone said things like "it sucks" that's not constructive at all and doesn't help any
. I think that most people who post photo's would appreciate constructive feedback for various reasons.

Again, I feel it's being a little presumptuous to assume that "most people who post photo's would appreciate constructive feedback for various reasons" Those that want a critique or feedback (other than hay that?s cool) usually ask for it.

The run of the mill dive shop will have you out taking millions of crap images and have little results to show from it. I think this is the wrong approach to take and we should be studying the works of great people like ansel adams and the like. Education thru mass production is not a good quality education.

No arguments on the first part. However, stating what, and whom, "WE" should be studying, is not really your place. I have admired Ansel Adems work since I took my first college photography class back in the seventies. Not all of us aspire to be like him, or any other famous photographer. Even if I did, I wouldn't be seeking a "good quality education" here.

Also those other boards that Dee mentioned caters mostly to the digital side of the house. There are those of us who shoot film and will not be switching to digital anytime in the near future.

Ed

Though I also shoot film, I don't see the difference, if you're trying to get away from discussing the same old equipment things. If you want to discuss composition or artistic techniques, what difference does it make if the image came from an F-100 or a D-100? To see them on-line, they all have to de converted to digital anyway. Besides there are many, many photography sites and boards on line that already cover the type of topics you think "WE" should be moving to. Just run a Google search on Photography Underwater Forum. Here are just a few of the ones I occasionally go to:

http://uwphotographer.net/
http://www.underwaterphotography.com/

http://www.scubaclicks.com/

This site has a critique section: http://www.nikonians.com/index.html

I also subscribe to an UW-Photo list. There are a lot of UW Pros and serious armatures there. Don't remember how to sign up, but you can send an e-mal to: photo@world.std.com to get the info.