200 yard surface swim..

[toodive4]

Please do us all a favor... 1. Learn how to swim and tread or 2. Stop diving before you even start.

I have twice been involved in incidents where people could not provide basic help to themselves. Both cases involved people who could not get themselves back to the dive boat. In one case the hapless buddy team (one buddy relying on the other to navigate) ended up a full 100 yards from the boat on a night dive in a slight current. They also failed to carry signaling devices (but that is another story.) They created a bad situation for the boat Captain, the other divers, the crew and themselves. If they were in good enough shape and could swim - they could have started back towards the boat... but as they later said, "we knew we couldn't make it that far - hell we never had to swim that far before." Maybe if they had been required to do it... the situation would have been better for all.

The swim test is not just a formality - your life may depend on your ability. Shops that "waive" this requirement are doing a disservice to themselves (for liability reasons,) the customer (for their own safety,) and the sport in general as the rest of us have to have our vacations ruined, effect rescues we shouldn't have too etc... Come on people... either swim and tread or get out of the water.

It is NAUI through the University of Florida's Academic Diving Program.

http://www.scuba.ufl.edu/

-V

 

[rottielover]

"slight current"

Some of us land-locked people have never "swum" in a real current before. So a "slight" 3 knot current could really panic someone.

Look, I know I'm a newbie, but your never going to attract people to diving unless you tell them solutions OTHER than "maybe diving isn't for you". I say hogwash, perhaps the solution in this case would be to get a bit more physically fit, to get your confidence level up. Walk around your block 4-5 times every few days, you'd be real surprised what just WALKING will do for you. 4 1/2 times around my horseshoe street is 1 mile, my wife and I started walking (briskly) around 5 times a day 3 days a week and JUST that little activity has really boosted our energy levels etc. We started doing that just a couple months ago, and we were both able to do the swim just last weekend with no problems..

In fact I think the more walking/running you can do the better, especially as divers. Since we don't use our arms, the stronger you leg mussels are the better.


Now I apologize if I stepped on any toes around here, but I have to get this off my chest, I started coming to scuba board less than a month ago, and I'm already about to leave and never come back. I'm sick of reading absolute CR@P about "PADI sucks, SSI Sucks, Split fins suck, this sucks that sucks" STOP IT ALREADY! YOU ARE PUSHING LURKERS AWAY FROM THE SPORT.

I told my instructor and DM this past week my absolute BIGGEST mistake I've ever made diving, was to jump on the internet and immerse myself in the "diving world on-line". All I did was fill my head with all the debates and all the negativity that seems to come from message boards.

Let's just all be more POSITIVE, maybe, just maybe, people will flock to diving when they realize what a great bunch of people there are doing it. What ever happened to "if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all". It doesn't take much to NOT click the POST button...

I would like to use an example to point out my view...

TooDive4 - I'd like to borrow your post for this, as an instructor I'm sure you know the value of such examples.

"Please do us all a favor... 1. Learn how to swim and tread or 2. Stop diving before you even start."

If your worried about the swim and tread, perhaps a swimming class would be of use. I know my Local Dive Shop also offers a swimming class. You can also check with local public pools and YMCA's. Several of the community pools in my area also offer swimming classes. If you already know how to swim, just do some physical activities, such as walking to boost your fitness level.

"I have twice been involved in incidents where people could not provide basic help to themselves. Both cases involved people who could not get themselves back to the dive boat. In one case the hapless buddy team (one buddy relying on the other to navigate) ended up a full 100 yards from the boat on a night dive in a slight current. They also failed to carry signaling devices (but that is another story.) They created a bad situation for the boat Captain, the other divers, the crew and themselves. If they were in good enough shape and could swim - they could have started back towards the boat... but as they later said, "we knew we couldn't make it that far - hell we never had to swim that far before." Maybe if they had been required to do it... the situation would have been better for all."

The swim/float test is a very important part of learning to dive. It demonstrates your ability to get yourself back to shore, or the boat in case you end up too far out. Here is an example of what I'm talking about: STORY

"The swim test is not just a formality - your life may depend on your ability. Shops that "waive" this requirement are doing a disservice to themselves (for liability reasons,) the customer (for their own safety,) and the sport in general as the rest of us have to have our vacations ruined, effect rescues we shouldn't have too etc... Come on people... either swim and tread or get out of the water."


OK, I'm done, I hope this is taken for what it is, constructive criticism. However, I've been around message boards long enough, so flame away.

 

[Walter]

So a "slight" 3 knot current could really panic someone.

There's no one here who can swim against a 3 knot current. A 3 knot current isn't slight, it's screaming! Most folks have a pretty hard time making progress against a 1 knot current.

 

[fishoutawater]

Walter is definately right. Three knots is screaming. I like to do a swimming drill in the Mississippi river. With my scuba fins, I try to tow my waverunner upstream with a rope around my waist. I'm a fairly strong swimmer, but it's always a losing battle. I still end up downstream, and I think the Mississippi generally only flows around 1 1/2-2 knots.

When I was a kid and first learned to dive, I was taught to not to HAVE to depend on my equipment. There were no BCs, and we didn't swim with wetsuits or fins. The idea was to be able to ditch everything and be able to make it back to shore depending on our own abilities.
Don't mean to dis anybody, but if swimming a measly 200yds in a pool is a daunting task, really consider getting in better shape for it. And while any reasonably active exercise does help, nothing helps improve swimming more than swimming.

(Rottie- good attitude. You'll do well) Good luck this weekend.

 

[BrianS]

His 3 knot current may be incorrect, but his entire post made perfect sense. And if that's all you could pick out of it, I'd say he did a good job.

There's no one here who can swim against a 3 knot current. A 3 knot current isn't slight, it's screaming! Most folks have a pretty hard time making progress against a 1 knot current.

 

[Walter]

Brian,

I wasn't trying to pick his post. I think he made some excellent points. I just didn't want to let that slip by and let anyone get the idea that 3 knots constitues a slight current.

 

[Hardnotty]

Rottie,

While I understand your fustration, you must also understand the purpose of a bullentin board is to bring together these different ideas and discuss (or in some cases debate) them.

Hearing different perspectives only provides me with more data to make a more informative decision. Also note that an opinion is like a bum hole, everyone has got one and will use it. This board is a means to express it.

I think any bullentin board site you go to.... this type of concern / issue will always there.

In this case.... with this topic, I've learned:
* It's a concern to many (so the original author can think, "Wow, I'm not along")
* The industry is not consistant about what is and is not required

The rest is opinion and taken as such.

Don't give up on the board.... it is a great tool to provide information and opinions.

 

[rottielover]

Sorry about the 3knot current thing, I was being sarcastic, and it was uncalled for


Hardnotty -

Yes, I understand that there is debate and differing points of view and opinions, however I'm talking about the WAY those opinions, points of view, and debate is offered up.

I think people tend to forget that with a message board such as this, that there are plenty of lurkers (those people that read the posts, but don't post anything), and I'm trying to express what my experiance has been thus far.

Phrases like "do us a favor and" or "maybe diving isn't for you" have such a negative impact on people. I'm trying to point out that re-wording our posts, being NICE to our fellow diver, all make a POSITIVE impact, and make us all look better to potential NEW divers.

Remember, it's not just people that sign up and take an OW course, we need to KEEP people diving, to keep them going with it, otherwise it's going to die out, and that would be such a shame.

Again, I apoligize for my sarcasm above, I was frustrated, and I can understand how people can be frustrated when they read virtually the same post over and over again by newbies, I'm just trying to make the point that negativity, when dealing with noobie's, is going to turn them AWAY.

Let's all try to be more positive tword the future of our sport.

/soapbox

 

[fishoutawater]

Well said Rottielover. It does the sport no good to scare people into thinking diving is for super he-man heros. But at the same time, diving really gives people a good reason to start living a more active/enjoyable life.
Sure lots of dives can be safely done without requiring a lot of physical exersion, but there are many many others that are hard work just to get to, before you even get into the water.
Shaws Cove in Laguna Beach comes to mind. You have to carry all your gear down a bunch of stairs just to get to the beach. Then there's the suiting up and walking backwards through the surf. By the time you get past the breakers, you're already sucking air big time. Nevermind the trip back up the hill after the dive. Makes you feel like you just went through BUDs. Then there's boat ingresses in six foot swells. That's another great thrill ride.
Being in shape just makes diving a lot more fun and more accessible.

 

[MoonWrasse]

200 yards or meters is only about 8 laps in a 25 yard/meter pool. It seems to me that if you can't do this untimed without stopping at the edge, you're not ready for open water activities, and might have difficulty not panicking in open water when there's nothing to hang onto.

First become comfortable just hanging out in water for extended periods of time, then try scuba.